Gavin MacMillan
Forum Replies Created
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Cheers Alan, all working now, ta
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Steven, I can understand why you do what you do and I have no problem with it. I would like to point out though that some companies like ourselves charge on material and time only, I don’t care what the total of the job is as long as our standard rates are met, as such customers are given a price and can take it or leave it, we do not look down our noses at smaller jobs they all add up.
I also understand other signmakers gripes but sometimes it sounds like total snobbery
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Thought I would bump this as it has answered a lot of questions for me. Thanks to Mr Gamble, though I am not up to your level of wrapping, you have given me confidence in the choice of material (85 series)
G
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Hi Alan, how do you assign the icon? That sounds ideal.
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yeah got that working, thank you.
Slightly long winded to get to but I’ve assigned a short-cut to ‘play’ (I think this is as far as you can go?) then if all your items are the same size as in my case here, it’s quicker to just duplicate and align the crop marks instead of going back in and creating more.
A definite time saving, thanks!
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Cheers Chris, I had a look and didn’t see any other way. I’ll just import it all back to signlab and get the file print ready there, seems like a lot of extra steps though!
G
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Just phoned smiths, 85 series is there only option for solid colour wrap vinyl. This would actually suit me as the rolls are 1520mm wide.
Anyone seen one of these vans or have an opinion about using this material on it?
Cheers,
G
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Cheers Rob, I’ll give smiths a phone today, was going to have a look at the vehicle and decide on the wheel, going to get them both at some point but unsure if this vehicle needs them at all.
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not sure about the ipad 2 features but the HTC flyer that will be out in the next couple of months comes with a stylus for note taking and diagrams. It also allows you to record sound so you can talk while note taking and the voice recording will be linked to what you were writing at the time.
this pen is amazing, a friend of mine has one and it’s essential for his studying as he is very dyslexic http://www.livescribe.com/en-gb/
But I’m hoping the flyer will be someway good at the same thing as well as doing lots of other things http://www.htc.com/www/product/flyer/overview.html
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Do you ever try and setup up with printer and it fails to see the pinch rollers? We had this happen and it slowly became worse over time, the culprit was the ribbon cable. This also gave other issues that we were more used to seeing with the encoder strip
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Don’t know anything about Mimaki so in no position to compare, just want to mention we have been running sp540 for 4 years now with no new print heads, we have had other issues of course but heads are the biggy and ours are still going strong. We do look after our machine and always get comments from service engineers about how clean it is kept.
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http://www.smile-plastics.co.uk/
recycled plastic sheeting. You could maybe also think about wood, taken from a sustainable source it’s as environmentally friendly as anything else.
G
Edit: you also get ‘xtra’ from Robert Horne, this has a black recylced pvc core with standard pvc to both faces in 10mm and is single sided in 3/5mm with white one side and black on the reverse.
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if you go to the UKSG members section it gives you login details to use on the tech8 site for getting a quote – I’ve not done this though so I don’t know if it gives a discounted price
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Just print as per standard vinyl, that’s really all it is except it has holes!
G
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Have now discovered you can also do this in signlab… could have done with knowing this 10 years ago!
This makes you even more fabulous Dave!
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Dave, you are the man!
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Nice one George, more of a stretch than ALT S but that is going to be very useful!
G
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Hi Martin, mainly cutting composites and some foamboard.
We already use a circular saw on rails with an extraction system. It’s one the main reasons I like the look of this as our saw is top notch and we would not want replace it. I would guess ours will fit this system but would obviously check that if we ever went for it.
Not a fan of the excaliber types myself, I’ve never actually used it but I think it would be too much work for the quantity of boards we cut. At the moment we use our saw on a custom bench we made and it works great but sometimes I think we could be doing things quicker! The main thing that slows us down is when the boards are all random sizes, when they are all the same we stack 2/3 sheets and cut all at once and you can through things quite quickly. Another thread was talking about guillotines, this would be a great option but I think space rules that out!
Cheers,
G
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A bump to see if there is anymore feedback on these? In particular the ZK10, as we would lose too much wall space with it fitted permanently. Looks good but then these things always do in the nice shiney brochure!
Cheers,
G
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quote Gavin MacMillan:on occasion wet is better and quicker with no risk of failure. These times are few and far between but they exist.quote Gavin MacMillan:Though the few occasions I do things wet is when it’s faster
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Again, agree with all your points Rob. Though the few occasions I do things wet is when it’s faster, not because it’s the only way I can do it.
Sometimes that situation must arise when you give give up speed for fitting dry? when wet wouldn’t be an automatic failure? Don’t get me wrong, I agree with you on fitting method but plenty people get by without fitting dry.
If you were the first to have the gerber then surely you applied wet back then? As far as I can tell it was the only way suggested by maufactureres, whatever there motives and who would make up there own way to do things and waste lots of expensive cast vinyl?
Great machine though, we nearly got our hands on one a couple of years ago, was the first machine I used when I started and we nearly got the very same machine.
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Can I just add a question into the mix?
Did anyone starting in the trade circa 25 years ago with a spandex gerber 4b ever get told to apply dry? Spandex were one of (if not the) original suppliers of vinyl and I very much remember reading spandex literature explaining how to apply wet and even going so far as to name the chemicals to avoid in your chosen brand of washing up liquid.
We now apply dry but started of doing things wet with no thought to an alternative as it was how we were shown. Time constraints and an increased skill level over the years moved us on to applying dry and would not look back.
Rob I agree with all your points but not your militancy – in my opinion, on occasion wet is better and quicker with no risk of failure. These times are few and far between but they exist.
Bob, if you did this full time as your only source of income you would now apply dry, materials have changed dramatically over the years and if you were doing it all the time I have no doubt you would have adapted like most people in the trade. With your experience you would very quickly adapt your existing skills to suit dry application. Your methods or not ‘wrong’ in my mind and I agree that you are not guaranteeing failures but you would be unable to compete on speed and therefore price using these methods.
Just my honest opinion.
G
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I have had similar problems and have read previously that it’s an almost impossible thing to do. Though the reasons you have given Dave don’t really work for me:
1: I don’t buy that – not enough to alter print length by 12mm
2: Roll media off the roll first – the weight of the media hanging would not effect it enough
3: Don’t use a take up
4: Don’t use a take upI’d like to hear from anyone who prints their own pop ups, we tried once (as a refurb) with limited success, nothing else we do matters that much as you can easily fix the problem with vinyl while applying.
G
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Brilliant stuff here, I reckon looking into the options given I will be able to get a system that works for us.
Thanks for all the help !
G
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Bob, what you have sounds along the right lines.
I don’t like press1/press2 any more than the next irrate call centre customer but the 2 of us who answer the phone deal with different jobs and tend not to cross over, I would like to avoid listening to his voicemail and having to give him messages all the time.
I was hoping that when calling the phone would ring as normal with no auto pick-up or music or anything and the press 1 or 2 scenario would only come into play when we are engaged to leave messages for a specific person.
I don’t know if this is possible or how to go about doing it, or if there is a much better idea out there that I just don’t know about.
Forwarding to mobiles and things, while useful in many situations doesn’t solve the main problem of being hard to reach, I guess we could have voicemail on the mobile but it puts me back at passing on messages not intended for me.
Cheers for the input, any more gladly taken!
G
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Ok so it is just me! I was quite good at chemistry in school though (I’ve forgotten it all now!)
Adrian: your reason is the best one! (no prizes but you may sniff some chemicals on your lunch break)
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Ok I was going ask yesterday but after the last post I have to ask now, what the hell do you actually do Adrian? Doesn’t sound like anything we do here with the kit you have?!?!? Not to mention the knowledge of bizarre chemicals though now more people are coming out the woodwork with information on chemicals I’ve never heard off, am I missing a big part of general knowledge or are there just chemical geeks on here?
G
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I think there is big difference between a good looking creative design and what Bob has showed on his previous vehicles. This is not a slating on those but more an observation that they are more boy racer than advertising and would certainly put me of using the company unless I wanted fast and furious graphics (they wouldn’t look great on my Peugeot estate though!) I agree with Bob that you shouldn’t have a design that puts people of but I think the only way to do this is to go to niche or just plain awful.
Edit: I like the look of the van by the way, Glenn’s take in particular
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Don’t know any companies of hand but the trade magazines normally have ads for installation companies who would fit the bill
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You should go on the next series of the apprentice Mo!
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in the cutter options there should be a ‘sort by’ section, choose ‘nearest first’ that should do the job. Apologies if i’ve missed the point or someone else has answered… rushing about!
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Aye, the premier inn ones on the website is the style I’ve looked at from them in the past.
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Insight sign systems do these with no additional joins i think!
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no I didn’t find out where or point out that it would cost a fair bit to get there and then be stuck in Glasgow for a day waiting to get your car back! I’m not really bothered about this guy, I doubt he would ever get it done anyway, the wrap version of a tyre kicker, but I don’t want to get a name for being pricey and like I said would actually not offer the service rather than be seen as over priced.
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I find this kind of thing hard to price without seeing the job, worked it out £50 cheaper, so I would say you are bang on (I would probably add £50 on to a job like this in case it took longer than planned!)
G
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what kind of guillotine would we be looking for? mainly for cutting composite and rigid pvc?
Ta
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Not really any reason not to cut with a stanley knife, I just don’t like the idea. I think cutting composite with a scalpel is dangerous though, too easy to snap the blades and they can ping in all directions.
A jigsaw would be my choice if I had no circular saw but I have in the past cut composite with a standard wood saw and even that does the job. Really though, a good saw is a standard bit of kit for signmaking I would say. I’d love a guillotine like Rob is describing, unfortunately we just don’t have the space.
G
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I wouldn’t attempt to cut composite with a scalpel! Or a stanley knive for that matter but definitely not a scalpel. If you have no circular saw then a jigsaw is the next best thing, quick going over with a sureform afterwards to sort the edge and you’re away.
G
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Cheers for the info, I’ll pass this on.
Didn’t really get any good pics, it’s dark here already!
It was an RS Fiesta and I thought it looked amazing, don’t know how good it will look by the time the guy drove home with the amount of salt on the roads!
G
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I’ve never used them for this kind of thing and there ad is horrific but when we used to use them for bits and bobs they were always good
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I think victory are now offering kits as well.
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Thanks for that, interesting to know that it was the printing side rather than application that caused issues. I’d have been so focused on the wrapping part I would have barely thought about printing!
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Looks good, if you don’t mind can you run through any areas where you had significant problems if you feel it will stop anyone having similar issues or help look out for potential hazards?
I’ve always been scared to tackle a vent like that, was that one of the problem area?
Cheers,
G
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roll the media out, don’t let the machine pull it off the core. You shouldn’t need to raise the head (or use the longer media clamps, but that’s personal preference) unless using super thick media.
The main reason for media buckling is usually the size of temperature change, do you store the banner in the same place as the printer? We had this with paper the other day and had to pre-feed the media over the heaters to help it adjust.
Basically banners should be no more issue than printing vinyl unless you forget to roll more slack of the core, so keep experimenting till it’s not being a nightmare! We use spandex banner media now.
G
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Rapid Tac glue remover is the best one I’ve found
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signwaves for me too but horizon also though they are more expensive
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I think Phill’s option is a good one. I would put it to the customer as an option and be willing to replace the whole panel if they prefer. My guess us the customer will be happy with the fix.
Also I think there is something more wrong here than getting done wet and overlap going the wrong way (see thread about back to front joins of trailers!) Looks like very cheap vinyl and although it’s been said it outgassed properly I’d be inclined to guess it didn’t, maybe through being stored badly. If this happened due to applying wet we would see threads like this everyday!
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The curtains are fairly cheap if bought in complete / printed. The curtain sided material is not particularly cheap and as Rob has said is tricky to apply. If possible go with subbing the whole job!
A few years ago we did one big printed panel on one side of a curtain sider, if we had done both sides the guy could have new curtains for the same cost! Was a massive hurry for the job though so just went with it. (it actually took a hell of a lot longer to apply that I had given, not a money spinner!)
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quote :we shouldn’t assume that every employee has a secret ambition to start their own sign making business
absolutely agree with that! Wages and how people are treated are factors also but not everybody wants to work for themselves.
G
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have you run a full virus scan?
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All dogs can be rehabilitated, their owners may not be capable of doing this but if a dog is aggressive to people or other dogs it is the fault of the owner – every time, regardless of breed.
I believe that dogs should be rehabilitated and re homed if there are problems, it’s something I feel really passionate about and if I didn’t do this job I would be trying to make a living out of doing this…. it’s still the back-up rainy day plan.
G
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probably easier to cut than acrylic, you can get in 3mm also and should still stand up to the kids
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Cheers for all the info on this guys.
Stuart what you are saying about the polyester vs vinyl is very interesting, cheers!
G
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Interesting, like I say we have used it lots of times, fully coated and with reverse printed clear backed up in white, all sorts of different ways and never had an issue. Glad to have found this out before this quote goes out though, thanks for the help!
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possibly on more that one layer? Right click on the layers part at the bottom and collapse all layers.
G
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I like it, just the right note struck I’d say.
Nothing wrong with how other people operate but for me Graeme’s solution starts from too strong a stand point, if that gets someones back up they could be completely stubborn and then you get nowhere. Different if it’s failure to pay for work carried out but when it’s more of a grey area I like a softer approach better.
G
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Aye I remember reading that in magazine a good few years back, makes a lot of sense really. Wrapping new vehicles for protection is a great idea really, we went about it the wrong way and waited till our van had been redone twice and had ghosting on it and then wrapped it.
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You could try a softer touch and write to the customer detailing the sequence of events that led you to order the material – detail the costs (selling price) of the material and also the value of your design time. Say this was all £500, ask for £250 as a good will gesture and see how it goes. I feel a more aggresive route may cause your customer to dig his heels in and you get nothing?
Also I would be wary of changing your working practices too much. How many times has this happened to you and how likely is it to happen again at any significant value? Enough to take an ‘i don’t trust you’ attitude with customers? Your clients probably appreciate and like how you work and it is more than likely good for your business. I know plenty people want deposits and such like but what works for some may not work for all.
G
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every day’s a school day! 😀 Didn’t know they did that but makes sense!
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a wrapped police car? Never seen one but I would expect any vehicle where lots of class one reflective had been removed by all but the most dedicated person to show signs of damage. I’ve never had to remove this stuff myself but I would hazard a guess it would not be fun and a disclaimer would whipped out pretty quick!
G
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spandex IP2408 poster paper is by far the best I’ve used and we have tried LOTS. Prints great and dries well, though not as good as a vinyl.
G
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well i should have just kept my trap shut then!
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I’m with Kevin, printing something onto etch will give a better finish than trying to print onto clear. There are not that many good optically clear films about and they are expensive, also with the inks being transparent it wont be very close to an etched finish. Only downside to printing directly to etch is that you will have no ‘clear’ bits that would normally be weeded out so it depends if that is important.
Otherwise you’ll just have to set aside a day and get comfy with your tweezers!
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Sorry I misread the post and didn’t notice it was a line of text. I would still do it as I described by getting a good match from the drawing or photo and then manipulating at the time of fitting, for me this would be a lot quicker than getting it mm perfect before cutting.
G
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Is it just the yellow line as shown? If so you should just be able to manipulate a straight line, failing that shape one roughly so it requires less manipulation but I would do that mostly by hand.
G
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Yeah I know it’s tough, also I guess if the offer is an October offer then it’s still not actually started.
I would probably chance my arm, but then order a few rolls for stock while the offer is on!
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I wouldn’t go back to Tesco but I would expect suppliers that I talk to all the time to put a wee bit more effort into looking after me, I’m with Derek on this! Kick them in the nuts… it’s the only way sometimes!
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Iphone sales actually come 3rd in the list of smartphone sales if organised by operating system. With so many phone brands using shared OS it’s not really surprising that the company that keeps all there stuff to themselves is further behind. Same reason why there are more machines running the windows OS than macs, I’m slagging of what they do, it’s a desision they made and it obviously works! But it’s always going to alienate some users who prefer a more open platform.
G
(still cant understand why people think the iphone OS is best… it’s been about for years with very little change while other people have copied it and improved on it!)
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I don’t know anything about hexpress vinyl but you need to be using a good cast material for this, calendered will never stay in there!
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The lock/blank/trace feature is an app (probably a few around) so possible on iPhone and all Android phones, not sure about other brands.
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typical iphone user response Peter 😀
Another benefit of not having an iphone is not being held by the knackers by apple also you get to feel smug when everyone else has an iphone and only you know that yours is better 😀
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HTC Desire for me – totally rocks! Galaxy and X10 are nice too, was looking at the galaxy tablet but I think HTC are bringing one out soon.
Main benefits over iphone is the sense interface giving you 5 ‘home’ screens that you can completely cusotmise with shortcuts and widgets instead of just an app list. You can even have different setups for work/ days off / travel etc… worth a look if your in the market for this type of phone. I would spend time comparing the UI and not so much on the spec as all these new phones are brilliant, it’s now about getting one that you like the interface on.
Think the X10 has 3 home screens but to be honest with 3 email accounts / bookmarks and a bunch of shortcuts sometimes 5 isn’t enough!
G
Edit: Desire can be bad on battery but most smart phones need charged every night anyway and mine always lasts the day unless I sit using youtube for ages!
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Sounds painful Hugh – do you have any kind of insurance through the club though?
G
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what was the error when it failed to print? Shouldn’t be memory after it has ripped. I think you may need to be methodical and eliminate things like cut lines, fades etc. certain design items can cause errors. Can you maybe post an image of what you are trying to print?
If it is still a memory problem, shut down your computer completely, not restart, then try again when it boots up without opening any unneeded software.
Edit – another thought, if you also have a dedicated rip like versaworks, just publish your file as a high quality pdf and print from there, has gotten us out of many a jam. Done this way all your cut lines and everything should work without any messing around.
G
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We mainly get this is we set up duplicates in signlab, if possible repeat in P&C. Also rotating bitmaps causes issues, again if possible create in the graphics in the orientation you want to send them to the printer.
G
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Thanks for the info Chris, I was hoping for more info from other users of these machines to try and gauge the benefits of paying the extra, so far I’ve learned that ‘100% of people who responded prefer heated machines’ 😀
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We always found it a nightmare loading, tricky to get the sheets fully secure, but there would be big cost savings so I guess it depends how often you are out fitting and how often what you are fitting would need to go on the roof?
G
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a quick bump to see people opinions, I thought this was a popular make? Maybe I’m looking at the wrong brand altogether?
G
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Better than anything I got… my suggestion was them buying a new car!
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The FSB seem to offer a good service for anyone that is a member – we haven’t actually taken it up but are thinking about it – We get asked a fair bit and it would also help when chasing bills, when people say ‘cheque will be posted…’ we can just ask for card details and take payment quicker. It may cause other problems but we are seriously thinking about it.
G
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Plex do them if they are not already your supplier.
G
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you are indeed correct – Scotch refers only to a drink, not to be used to describe anything other than whisky! A lot of people use it though and it’s pretty annoying, other terms like ‘jock’ are fine (just as well) but scotch is just plain wrong!
Edit: to correct terrible grammar!
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Hi Mo,
I didn’t mean to sound negative about it, I’m sure plenty people do a lot of good stuff with it, we just never found it worthwhile.
G
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We used to use acuflow and they seemed fine but that was a while ago, grafityp do the kits also but the advantage we found with acuflow is they will sell the cartridges in singles, as they have a short shelf life we found this better that having to buy packs for a small order.
All that said, we found doming to be full of issues and stopped it fairly quickly, it’s a pain and we didn’t do it often enough to get into a good system and therefore never found it worthwhile.
G
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as a work round I always go to ‘send image by email’ and create a quick pdf if I need a better view. This can be on low quality if it’s only vector and only take a few seconds.
G
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I’m sure this was up as a sticky in the UKSB forum? Hopefully Rob will see this or it’ll be back when that forum it put back up.
G
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same here and with no idea to the cause. I remember threads about it before, it seems to be an issue with the machine but seldom noticeable. We normally fix it by upping the print quality and/or slowing the machine down.
It tends to happen on certain colours or weights of ink, sky in photographs sometimes and light yellow – always seems to be pale images / feint colours
Not much help I know.
G
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Dan I would question whether a thin pvc sign may be a better option? Seems like a lot of messing for a short term sign? Though with it being short term, laminate probably won’t do any harm.
Rob – the customer may have wanted the banner laminated for various reasons and heavier material would be the answer in a lot of situations. Obviously it wont help UV, abrasion or chemical attack but it is a better and stronger solution
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I just wouldn’t do it. Vinyl laminate wont last and wouldn’t be convinced that liquid lam would be any better. I’m sure I’ve read before that some do it but we don’t and wouldn’t either. If they want it harder wearing buy in from a good trade supplier (ours uses a heavier pvc than we are able to handle in house)
G
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I thought you had, that must have been tricky getting that to all line up – good job!
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dry mostly but on certain applications wet is simply quicker so we do these things wet
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There has been negativity about staff here before but the fact is if you are a small business they are one of your biggest assets – pay him right for what he does, yes stop him skiving too much but lets face it how many of us are on here through the day. A bit of slack as long as it doesn’t go to far will keep it a nicer more relaxed place to work. Make sure being on the net isn’t when theres a backlog of work then it’s not really a problem. Being late on the other hand… well no excuse, if he is getting it a raise make him prove he can get there on time (or 5 mins early as the rules are here) before hand and let him know the raise is on condition of that continuing!
As for the amount, thats up to you and is going to vary depending on location, other business’ in your area are probably a better gauge than anyone on here.
G
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Standard clear vinyl works well too if budget is an issue. Use graffiti cleaner if there are any problems and spray paint comes of no bother.
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Trailers hit more trees/branches than things like trains, another reason to fit from back to front. It’s what I was taught at the wrapping course so how I always fit – it makes so little difference when applying the job, why go the other way and risk it being wrong?
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We do it the same way and get the same problem on white banners – fattening it up as suggested works for us.
G
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I always found this a weird, why would anyone get a signmaker to do a logo if the signmaker then claims to hold copyright on it? You could, in theory, do a fleet of vans and then refuse to let them use their own logo (that they paid you to create!) on stationary or website!
I don’t know the law on this but if you charge your time to the customer then they have ‘commissioned’ the artwork so I don’t see how you can claim to have copyright on it? Fair enough, you don’t have to email the files to another sign maker but it the customers brand at the end of the day, not the signmakers.
All fairly pretentious in my opinion.
G
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Don’t know anything about the credit card thing but Hugh there is no way you should be slitting rolls yourself, if they don’t have the width you order it should be slit by them and supplied to you. Yes you may have to have 2 rolls if it’s a small order but slitting it yourself is a joke and if I found myslef doing that, I’d be finding a new supplier.
G
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I know you have being doing it for years with no probs so are you using a different media? We have had problems in the past with materials with a ‘waxy’ feeling backing paper seeming to slip slightly while cutting.
G