[Colin Crow]

Thanks all, I think you have confirmed what the specs were saying. I haven’t bought the Roland yet by the way, just looking at the alternatives for our current setup. Am also considering the Summa DC4sx but can’t get any feed back from users and the data available isn’t as comprehensive as that for the Versacamm.

When all is well I have pushed the lengths to nearer 3 metres but you have to remember that because this is only 300 wide this is still only 30 sets of A5 sheets of decals. There are so many variables when printing and cutting these fine detail sheets that I have to do most of this myself rather than being able to leave the task to someone less experienced. Hence my search for a print&cut machine that will give me similar quality with less user inout.

Thanks

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Some acrylic suppliers will supply the red acrylic with the "holes" pre-cut and then supply the exact yellow and white letters to fit perfectly into the holes. Since it’s all cut by CNC there are usually no gaps and if you use a gap filling adhesive like tensol there should be no problems. To give extra support to large cut outs it’s necessary to overlap the rear of the letters with pieces of clear acrylic in a few places.

All the best illuminated signs are constructed this way as it offers uniform light transmission and longevity since there is no vinyl to fade.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Haven’t tried this myself as I use signlab but you may find this number generator utility for X3 useful?

http://www.unleash.com/jeffh/numbering/index.asp

Colin

[Colin Crow]

It sounds like LED strips would be more suitable, the control being much easier due to the lower power. There are quite a few people on the internet offering bespoke solutions for controllers. You could try here for example:

http://www.ledsolutions.co.uk/

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Shane, I knew you would be quicker because you have two Ezytapers. You probably wind one with each hand 🙂

Gavin, it depends on the boards. Clean cut dibond doesn’t have much swarf and virtually no static so easy. Foam or pvc takes a bit more vacuuming and then cleaning with the home-made lint roller so add 5-10 mins I suppose.

The other main benefit is that it is easy to train people to do this while you earn your money elsewhere. I now have two office based people here that could do the job on the ezytaper but wouldn’t attempt it manually.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

To be honest cleaning the boards takes longer than the mounting. We regularly mount 1220 x 450 digital prints onto 3mm dibond and then laminate (so 2 processes) and if I dont do 20 per hour (ie 40 applications) I am slacking, and that includes trimming as I go since the print is dry. Add to this no mopping up and single handed operation so someone else can answer the phone!

10 prints your size all prepared should take less than 20 mins once you have got used to the Ezytaper.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

12mm model for me. In 6 months of mainly mounting onto foamex and dibond, only once had need to mount onto something thicker which was overcome by thickening up edge of 10mm foamex after mounting. (print needed to be wrapped around 20mm thick substrate).

One trick for loading curled materials (particularly laminates) when mounting onto boards, is to buy a nice thin steel rule and lay this along the front edge of the laminate when inserting the board. This allows you to check overall positioning of the print/laminate and keeps the front edge in even contact with the board at the crucial point of take-up. Rolling the print and rule through together leaves no evidence on the print and maintains the even take-up.

Collin

[Colin Crow]

Hi Joe

When I met you on the stand I knew I had seen your face before but have only just realised it was here on the forum!

Quick update to my previous problems with my EzyTaper – Having discussed this with Peter prior to NEC it seems I may have had the last rogue taper and he has now supplied a complete new machine and all is now working as it should.

Absolutely Brilliant service (given this was more than 6 months old) and for anyone still hesitating just buy it – I guarantee within a very short time you will kick yourself for not buying it earlier!

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Had our ezyTaper for some time now but still not entirely happy with it. Never successfully applied application tape without wrinkling and ruining the vinyl so have given up with that now. Works fine most of the time applying small to medium size prints to panels but skewing has always been a problem and laminating can be hit and miss.

Peter has tried to help by sending the center adjustment modification to eliminate the obvious uneven gap across the rollers but I have not seen the pressure sensitive tester or the loading handles promised some time ago. I suspect mine was possibly one the units that suffered damage on the journey from Aus and consequently has inherent problems. I was hoping to bring this up with Peter or Warwick next week at the NEC.

Would be interested to hear if anyone has had similar problems?

Colin

[Colin Crow]

You could try this one?

Colin

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[Colin Crow]

The water based pigment ink in my Canon is no problem at all – even straight after printing. The biggest problem is finding places to hang the darn things while they dry in an already overcrowded workshop!

[Colin Crow]

I have to jump on the Ryobi bandwagon here. I have used them alongside dewalt and found them longer lasting with more torque. The price and variety of accessories in the ONE+ system is also a real bonus. Protrade do some great deals on combination sets and the 18V jigsaw and circular saws really do work!

[Colin Crow]

I find it much quicker and smoother to us a gloss foam mini roller for applying liquid laminates to canvas. Graffityp supply a good UV inhibiting version for around £30/litre which goes quite a long way.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Graeme

Their rep sent me the quote this morning so I am not sure why there is such a difference. 2mm £ 34.60 & 3mm £39.88 for the white version. If you know them it may be worth asking them to match? They have only recently switched from Alcom product to this one so may be confusing the more expensive prices. There may also be a heavier grade as this was quoted as "lightweight" which refers to the ali thickness (.24ml opposed to .3ml for dibond)

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Europoint now do their own branded Skybond which has a slightly lighter weight aluminium face (like most cheap versions) but starts at around £35 for an 1250×2550. Best part is it has pe coating on both sides unlike the cheapest brands which often come scratched on the back.

[Colin Crow]

Thanks Mike, I will keep this on record as that particular customers seems to have gone elsewhere now.

[Colin Crow]

Thanks Dave

I have seen that Hexis have 3 types listed in their catalogue, including one paper one, but they give no indication of how they are used. With the rubber you used, did you weed and tape as normal vinyl or is there some other application?

[Colin Crow]

David is correct. Openoffice has this facility built and a lot more useful features which puts it head and shoulders above Word. Best of all its completely free so you can have legitimate versions on all your PCs. We have been using it for a year now and have found few problems. You can find it here

http://www.openoffice.org/

Oh, and poor old Bill Gates doesn’t get a penny 😀

[Colin Crow]

I think the update will sort the problem but let us know how you get on Dave.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Dave

I was experiencing a similar problem with early versions of 7.1 particularly when using decal mode. You will need to ensure you are running the latest update of 7.1 which has cured this problem. You should be able to download this from their site. They are now on build 7 of 7.1 which has sorted virtually all gripes. If you have any problems speak to Cadlink who still have the best customer support team of any software of I have owned.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Found this one amongst my files but unfortunately it is probably the easiest of the lot to digitise. Will have another look for the rest.

Colin

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Warn.eps

[Colin Crow]

We have used a D60 with opus for about 18 months now. You will only need the opus if you intend to print and cut and if you do you will find it very accurate and reliable but there is a learning curve. We also run a Mutoh SC650 which is similar money but in my view probably a better machine. Tracking on the summa is not as good as mutoh unless you load the rolls of media onto the spool carriers which is a real pain if you change vinyls a lot. Also the summa only has a rear sensor for the vinyl so the front origin is set at wherever you load the media. If you forget to roll back after loading and hit enter you will waste the front 6" or so on each cut. The mutoh also has a sheet off facility which we use all the time to great effect for repeat jobs. Our mutoh is just beginning to "splutter" after 10 years of heavy use and when it dies I won’t hesitate in replacing with another.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

We used to print umbrellas using a normal clam press but you will need room beneath the press for the handle to dangle down. Grafityp and victory sell fabric vinyls suitable for nylon printing or if you have a colour laser then TTF paper from magic touch does the job on white panels of umbrellas.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Dave

Are your problems registering the various spot colours, aligning CMYK or registration on the contour cuts. Also, what software are you using?
Feel free to pm or email me on this if you don’t want to hijack this thread.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

We have found that the registration problems can be improved/eliminated most of the time by not using the cheapest vinyl/foils you can find.

As for products,

There is a large market for short runs of vinyl labels which keeps our machine busy for a lot of the time. Often used to personalise products where screen printing isn’t viable.

Self cling and reverse printed clear vinyl for window displays – often flood coated with white.

Safety signage, warnings and evacuation details – personalised for specific companies.

To name but a few.

Its true the cost of running an edge may be more expensive than solvent printers (although few take into account cleaning costs) so its better to concentrate on markets that can’t be satisfied by the cheaper methods. Mirror chromes, metallic golds and (proper) white printing make up a lot of what the edge does for us and this usually commands a premium price.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Some on here are too quick to knock the edge! Ours paid for itself producing items not possible on even the best ink jet in less than 6 months. It continues to coin in on markets the "inkies" only dream about. There is little to touch it for decals, stickers and labels, so for occasional use in a confined space the no-clogging, no-smelling, no-aggro benefits easily outweigh any advantages of a wider format solvent type inkjet.

Price – well if it gets you in and allows you to sleep at night then it’s fair. Buying on ebay etc could land you with 2K bills if the head goes next week. Spandex will honour their guarantee so see if you can coax a year out of them.

You need to know your market and buy accordingly. No machine is going to do everything but an edge is a good way to get an introduction into digital printing without many of the pitfalls.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Sorry Shane

Talking about a different tool altogether. Please ignore my comments.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Shane

Got a cheap version (Ferm brand) of this some time ago for around £40 but have found little use for it. I tried decent Bosch made cutters but still found anything thicker than a few mm would cause the cutter to break. Foamex melted behind the cutter making a very poor finish. It is difficult to use hand held without a guide due to it’s lack of weight and overall a half decent router gives a much better finish. The only real job I found for it was cutting out wall sockets in plasterboard. On the other hand my nephew bought the real thing and said his works well but I am not sure how much he has used it.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

I use Flexisign, Corel X3 and Signlab (mad I know) but they all have their uses. My version of Flexi is now old but used for specific repetitive work on a Mutoh SC650 cutter (brilliant – 10 years old and going strong).

I have used Corel for design since version 3 so know it backwards but still only use 50% of its power most days. In my opinion the standard for printing design vector software which others strive to copy.

Signlab as a design, print and cut program is unsurpassed with facilities I could only dream of when I started in this game. Best of all is the support with real people to talk to who listen and come up with the goods. If you want to cut vinyl and can afford it, buy Signlab, you will not regret it.

On another note my Summa D60 came with a plug in for Coreldraw. I haven’t tried it yet but intend to do so soon a there are still one or two printers not supported by signlab.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Everyone chases every bit of work when starting. The trick is to work out which ones are profitable for you and learn to say no!

As for the name, I like the individual touch and came up with a variation on what others have suggested.

Colin

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[Colin Crow]

Andy

Not sure what equipment you are using but we usually customise and jazz up window cling on our Edge with mirror silver outlines/shadows to give that extra value look.

Have also seen the small sail type banners in one the catalogues (renzel?) where its held in place by the front wheel of the car. I know our local Audi franchise uses these to good effect. Perfect for car of week or similar?

If you need any help with customising/pricing the cling please PM/mail me.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Firstly for external work you will need the pigmented version of this printer to ensure the ink is waterproof.

The vinyls that are suitable for inkjet printing tend to be thicker than normal vinyl used in cutters at around 100 microns. Add a laminate and this does make the whole thing thicker and less conformable. This works fine for large areas but I haven’t tried cutting labels yet as we tend to do these using our Edge.

There are quite a few white matt vinyls available and the Canon stretch vinyl is the best and cheapest I have tried so far. I have only found one gloss vinyl to date but if you are going to laminate this isn’t an issue.

I haven’t found a suitable clear vinyl, film or window cling yet as for some reason these are specified as dye only (but I have been told to try these anyway).

There are several scrim banner materials available again with a matt finish. They quote 6 months maximum life unlaminated but this is easily improved with a quick coat of liquid laminate like Frog Juice or similar.

[Colin Crow]

I think its very much a case of horses for courses. Where I am there are far too many trade suppliers chasing the solvent work to make this side pay at the moment. The Canon gives us the opportunity of bringing wide format to our existing customers (often at premium prices) so any marginal additional cost of materials is irrelevant. Add this to the £10,000 saving over a six-colour solvent printer (sorry – the 4-colour machines don’t cut it for me) and it really does stack up. Oh and did I mention it will print a M2 in around 2 minutes at maximum dpi?

As for longevity, I am sure there are a few fine art people on the forum that will know more about this subject but my understanding is that the solvent/water carrier has little or no bearing on the fading of a print, it is all down to the quality of the pigments/dye.

And while we are beating the drums for solvent printers, I have had two jobs quoted recently (a school & a chain of shops) where they specifically stipulated that solvent based inks (they didn’t mention ecosol) were not to be used for environmental reasons. Personally I think the days are numbered for full solvent machines and once the UV machines become cheaper/better quality they will be phased out or banned altogether.

There, that’s stirred a hornets nest!

[Colin Crow]

Here’s Harry our 6 yr old Airedale Terrier who has never grown up ( I was warned!) along with Millie my daughter. He needs a good trim really but everyone loves the "teddy bear" look and they moan when do him.

Colin

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[Colin Crow]

In reality all prints (water or solvent) should be laminated for outdoor use to achieve maximum UV resistance. The pigmented inks have been proved to last as long as solvent types for fade resistance in external situations given the same lamination.

As for pricing, the Canon stretch vinyl, which although not as thin as cast, is very flexible and very economical at around £4.50 M2. The inks seem more expensive but again last longer so not much disadvantage. Also you will need to take into account that you will not have to clean and flush as with solvents since blockages are almost non-existent even with the machine left for days between printing.

You will not get anywhere near the price of these Canons when looking at solvent printers and if you want 6 colours to match the quality then its a whole new ball game again.

[Colin Crow]

We have had one of these for a week or so now and I have to say the quality of print is fantastic. They print a waterbased ink which can be either dye based for internal work or pigment based which is waterproof. You have to have special coated media for best results and for proper long term outdoor use these should be overlaminated. Don’t pay too much though as there are some brilliant deals around from authorised dealers at the moment while they sell off stock of the 6 colour machines prior to release of the 12 colour version this Christmas. There are only 2 authorised distributors (Velmex and InfoTec) so contacting these will tell you who your nearest reseller is. Media is available from all the usual people (Europoint, hexis, McNaugton etc)

Hope this helps

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Dave

No that price was for both the internal unit and external condenser. It was from http://www.just-coolers.com/ but I am not sure of their latest prices as they vary with demand. I ended up installing 3 more of these units for family and friends so got it down to about 2 hours! I only paid £239 + vat and delivery for the last two systems once they got to know me. They do all the brackets and extra pipe etc if required. The site explains fitting etc and I think you can download instructions. Hope this helps but if you want any further info pm or mail me.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

We installed one of these do it yourself AC units this summer mainly to keep the humidity down but it was also a big help when t-shirt pressing. The big bonus is that using it now as a heater the workshop has never been so warm and apparently it’s 300% efficient (although I have no idea how they work that out). I do know the compressor only draws 6 amps or 1.2 kw but easily outperforms a normal fan heater. The two part AC units can be had for as little as £250 ex vat and are a doddle to fit (about 3 hours max).

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Thanks Jamie, but I could only find this in bold too.

The laugh is that I have been following an example of the sign which is clearly arial rounded regular but when I checked the guidelines again it specifies arial rounded MT bold! So now I have to check back with the design dept to see which is correct.

Thanks anyway.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Hi john, tried this but because the font isn’t even thickness it results in some parts almost disappearing when thinned down using the inline method.

I eventually found a light extended form of VAG which when I squash up does a fair impression for now, but the right one would be better.

Cheers

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Oh well, thanks for the thought!

Colin

[Colin Crow]

We have been looking at this laminator too. Phil, any further info on an alternative (particularly cheaper) would be much appreciated.

Ta

Colin

[Colin Crow]

I have never had a problem using snap-fix fastenings on either foam, acrylic or dibond/aluminium. If you fix direct to an uneven wall then marking out will be difficult, fixings variable and any unevenness in the wall will result in 3mm acrylic flexing which will be visible if glossy finish.

For a more up market finish we usually persuade the customer to have an aluminium sign tray fitted and then fix the letters to this. Ashby produce these very economically and fixing is a doddle. The overall effect easily looks worth the additional outlay.

Good luck

Colin

[Colin Crow]

forgot to mention that you should check out the "all sizes" tab in the top left corner of the pic. This gives access to the higher res versions.

[Colin Crow]

Have you tried FlickR.com ? There are a lot of images that are public domain and free to download, for example:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/26845282@N00/268305862/

or do search there for "fork lift"

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Thanks for the info on these pen companies but my customer actually makes the wooden pens himself. He was looking for decals or water slide to mark them with a company logo but I think he was put off when I told him how long it would take to waterslide 500 pens!

I have now found someone that will "pad" print the pens quite cheaply but I would still be interested to hear from anyone who knows about these flatbed inkjets to see how they compare pricewise.

Cheers

[Colin Crow]

Another tip, if using fully hollow poles, is to insert a cheap steel scaffold pole to give added strength. Obviously this doesn’t work with the slotted type poles.

[Colin Crow]

Thanks Chris, we produce a lot of decals for our sister company, mainly for modellers, so the quality is a big issue for us. The decals on models don’t get the same treatment as vehicle graphics so will probably last long enough without lamination. The only vinyls I have seen so far that can be used with pigment printers seem quite a bit thicker than the norm and this may be a problem for conformability over the curved surfaces.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Is there anyone out there with a similar printer that has printed either Vinyl or backlit media?

Thanks

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Model boats are our speciality I’m afraid, but when I need detail of the text and decals you can usually find good pics on the web. Try the marin site on
http://www.mv-marin.fi/eng/mv-marin5400.html
This is obviously the current range but you can also find boat yards selling second hand with good photos.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Sorry peter, I was a bit slow there replying. I have used the longer SS ties for a while now and although they don’t pull quite as tight as the plastic ones they are far more resilient to vandalism. You can extend then by adding one to another just like the plastic type and the the gripping is done with a tiny ball mechanism which which holds fast once tightened. All in all, highly recommended.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Just to add to the cable tie suggestion, if you want something a little tougher then screwfix now sell stainless steel cable ties which are great or this sort of use.

[Colin Crow]

Not an ideal solution but you could put some clear removable vinyl through the cutter to produce exact size strips to wrap over the edges a bit like double glazed panels are sealed. Obviously these will remove easy but have limited life. I have also found that Oracle 751 cast clear removes easily from acrylic surfaces – (I use pieces to protect my mobile phone screen!) so would be longer lasting and very clear.

Good luck

[Colin Crow]

I can cover the print head separately at £26 per month or £312 a year. Given that the head is now 1 year old and a further 3 years will cost £936 does this seem like a good investment? How long do the print heads last on average? I remember reading somewhere that you can get the edge to tell you it’s meter reading but can’t remember the sequence of keys required.

Anyone help?

[Colin Crow]

Just the normal 12 months which is due to end shortly. There are various levels (and costs) of cover but without this they are quoting £250 call out within 10 days! or £450 for 5 days which sounds a little ludicrous.

I suppose I will be forced to take out one of the contracts but even these are working out at £30-40 a month and exclude the print head.

[Colin Crow]

Spent 4 hours or so at the show on Wednesday (7 hours driving!) and have to say I didn’t recognise any of you from your photos! Although I suppose that’s fair as I haven’t got round to posting one myself.

Had a brilliant chat with David Evans at Cadlink and was dead chuffed to see they have incorporated virtually all my requests into 7.1 – (I really do believe of all the software I have ever owned Cadlink have given the best support)

Bought a new Summa plotter at knock down price with a load of bits thrown in.

Think I may have found an alternative supplier of copier vinyl (fingers crossed)

So all in all, a result! just a shame about the ******* M25

Just one question to all you Cadet owners – how do you put up with the smell? I was getting high just standing next to one watching it print!

[Colin Crow]

Thanks again

I have spoken to them and it seems this is a polyester also. They are sending a sample so again once I have trialed it I will post my results in case anyone else is interested.

Since all their sales staff are at NEC I am due to see them at the show tomorrow to discuss prices etc.

Cheers

[Colin Crow]

Thanks

I have contacted them and they are sending a sample. Their pricing seems to be for ones and twos at £1.50 for an A4 so they are going to quote me for boxes of 100.

I will let you know how I get on.

[Colin Crow]

The Mactac swatches have the equivalent RAL numbers in the bottom left corner. These seem to be approximate but may help.

3003 is similar to pantone 202 for example.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

You could do it in strips with an edge. I do this sort of printing all the time onto clear window cling with both white backing and white edges (even chrome) with no problem. Just depends if you can suffer the strips or need it in one piece.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Depends how much tape you need, but this could be produced on the edge quite cheaply.

Dibond is available as 2mm with brushed ali finish on one side. Its a bit more expensive than the one Robert quoted but has a lovely finish thats very durable. We write it in vinyl all the time for hanging cafe/restaurant signs.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Thanks for the feedback on the Summa, Becky. I will have to put this on my Christmas List!

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Dave

I am now using signlab 7 and the GS15 plus (HPGL) driver. I have tried all of the relevant drivers including the GSPGL, which didn’t solve the long job problem. E6 also gave me the same fault on all drivers.

If you cut the same offending job, is it always the same part that doesn’t cut? This would point to consistent problem ie buffers or software rather than a flaky com port.

Becky,

I am very interested to hear that someone has got this combo working. When I had all the problems with the GS15+ at the start I asked both Spandex and Cadlink if they had any record of any user using the edge with a Opus type cutter but got nowhere.

I may have to add another plotter in the future and gather you are impressed with the Summa. Which model do you use? Do you have any trouble tracking the sprocketed material and whats the longest “safe” run?

I know Mutoh do a similarly equipped model (I already have a 650 without the alignment hardware) does anyone know if this works as well?

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Hi Dave,

Do you mean that it used to crash and sound the alarm but that has stopped now, albeit some of the plot hasn’t been cut?

Is this just on complicated files? I presume you have checked that all of the cut outlines are shown in the preview?

How old is your system? Spandex kindly loaned me an old envision to try to see if this had the same the problem (which it didn’t).

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Yippee! it worked, the only question is why didn’t I try here first?

Thanks again David and Becky

[Colin Crow]

David,

Found the FIFO disable button now so will give it a try and report back. Thanks again

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Becky,

No, no noticeable difference in cutting speed but since the GS15 is so slow anyway (even compared to my 7 year old mutoh) its hard to tell. This particular file used to cause the GS15 to stop around 35 mins into the plot, around 40% complete.

I didn’t consider the speed a problem if it could be left overnight cutting the edge output printed during the day, but now that isn’t possible. On the other hand, registration over this sort of length looks like it will also be a problem so I am having to reconsider this product.

Turning the speed of the transmit from the port down from maximum of 16 to lowest setting of 1 has doubled the time before the alarm sounds, but still not enough to complete a cut on a “reliable” length of printed vinyl. say 2-3 metres of 2 colour work with lots of detail cutting.

David,

Once again thanks for researching this. Could you clarify what you mean by FIFO buffers. Using XP, Paul in support has advised to lower the com port transmit rate – is this the same thing? If not help would be appreciated. If you need to give more detailed explanation please email on colin@becc.co.uk

Many thanks

[Colin Crow]

Gave up after about an hour of cutting which is twice as much as normal. This may be enough to cut the job in smaller parts but not the unattended all night jobs promised.

Becky, do you have Omega as well as signlab? If so do you get similar problems?

Thanks

[Colin Crow]

I have spoken to Cadlink, who in turn have spoken to Tony Winterbottom and I have now adjusted the ports transmit rate to the lowest setting.

Running the first trial now and so far so good – fingers crossed.

[Colin Crow]

Thanks Becky,

I thought it was just me. Can you remember who told you what to change? Was it Cadlink, Spandex or someone else.

I had a feeling that it would be something like this as it always falls over at the same point indicating some sort of buffer overflow but Gerber don’t want to know because I am not using Omega (even though Spandex supplied the Signlab).

I have tried it using e6 and get the same result. Have you fully cured the problem now?

Cheers

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Thanks Mike, I will ring them tomorrow. I used to use them a lot in the past but haven’t dealt with them for about 3 years now.

Cheers

Colin

[Colin Crow]

I’m with Bob on this one. Only had my Edge 1 for a couple of months and already picked up jobs not possible on other equipment. 1,700 “expensive” white and gold mirror foil on window cling decals was very nice indeed! Lets see the ink brigade do that one. Horses for courses I think.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Hi Dave

Curious this, I can’t remember who put that idea into my head and I can’t find any news to back up such a thing, however looking at the numbers it wouldn’t surprise me to see some sort of shake up soon. Their plan to move away from premium products to more middle market doesn’t seem to be producing the returns they need to satisfy their huge debt.

Either way, just heard I have another nice job confirmed as a result of the client being pleased with the mirror gold foil on the cling!

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Same again here. We used to supply “specials” and slips (the bits they stick over to say sold etc) to a company that specilised in fitting these. They had 4 transit sized vans working all day long doing this in kent and surrey and still complained about price.

I know they paid £6.00 for a pair of 30″ x 24″ residential correx type signs but these were obviously screened by the 100. We used to charge about £40 a side for the commercial 4′ x 3’s we did on a regular basis for them. Dont forget to allow for the expensive correx d/sided tape needed for the back-to-backs used on residential signs.

Its a cut-throat business and I know they had shed loads of old correx boards where the client had moved on.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Martin,

I have asked cadlink about this and this feature is due in later revision as is the facility to align the skew on the cutter. I am learning to love some of the strengths of signlab but do think these are essential if they are going to sell it as part of an edge package. I am starting to worry that I will need these features to really make the edge work properly.

Bob,

Ironically, the cling and white foil were both supplied by spandex (who I believe now own Gerber) and it was this that was giving the problem. The only non-gerber product, the mirror gold foil (like gold medal -which I am told is a no-no on cling) worked faultlessly throughout. To Spandex’s credit they did offer to look into the problem for me but time didn’t allow and I like a challenge anyway!

This forum is a brilliant way to talk to people who know what they talking about.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

I did wonder if heat build up was a problem. When the cling first stuck I rested the edge for 1/2 an hour and it worked a little better but still stuck again shortly after and continued to do so until I changed the cartridge. I was running 5M at a time until I get more confidence.

Another thing I have noticed is that irrespective of how many colours I print the first colour always starts slightly before the remaining colours. I have tried taking the tension off the roll etc but this is consistent over the whole print run.

I understand that omega has some adjustments that can be made for both printing and cutting but as I’m using signlab thats not a lot of help!

I am not knocking the system though – its already earned me a chunky lucrative job that I would have had to turn away otherwise.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Thanks to all

I have been doing my homework and using all the settings correctly, especially the static cling selection and been printing in only 5 metres at a time. I didn’t adjust the intensity, but you are probably correct there and it’s given me somthing else to try for the next job. The angle of the foil strip seems feasible, as my time spent crouching on the floor trying to see what was happening showed that the problem was occuring when the print was at it’s widest, meaning that the amount of “pull” was greatest and thus the sprockets gave up.

One other quick question from a novice – why do the dancer bars and head get clogged with resin when these don’t actually come into direct contact with the resin side of the foil. Is it due to migration of the resin when it is in contact with the top surface of the carrier on the roll?

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Hi Dave

Thanks for coming back on this.

Two problems, same cure. I have been doing a large cling job (gerber white supplied as deal + print one mirror gold) and all was well for the first 40 metres and then the cling kept getting jammed in the edge on the first white print. All rucked up around the sprockets. Did everything like cleaning heads, sprockets etc but wasted total 10 metres material with same problem. Changed cling to new roll same problem. Changed cartridge (gerber) and bingo! no problems at all until… 10 metres from end of cartridge same problems. Swapped again and fine again. Mirror gold worked perfectly right up until it ran out.

Now I have 2 cartridges with 8+ metres on so I try another normal vinyl job with the white and notice that registration is worse than normal. If this is normal it is going to be a pain keeping cartridges of differing lengths. Is it just the last 10 metres that causes the problem? if so it will definitely be worth buying the 91m rolls.

Thanks

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Hi Dave,

True, it’s tough moving over to this screenprint type technology. I think most of what you need is to do with inlay weld which will add a small amount of overlap to stop the white bits showing, and secondly you have to make sure these pieces are not set to the default knock out which removes the colour beneath. Instead you have to apply the overlay to the pieces concerned. I like the way you can just drag the overlay from the menu onto the colours as required.

Hope this makes sense or email me and I will have a go – no promises though – still a novice!

Colin@becc.co.uk

[Colin Crow]

Again, had problems with foamex fixed all round (cheapskate customers request) Dark vinyl areas heated up and buckled horribly. Also had a case of an 8′ x 4′ x 10mm foamex panel rip right through its screw cap fixings and never found it! Only lasted 3 days – never again.

If you must use foamex, always suspend it like a curtain to avoid buckle. I think they work on 1% for normal expansion which doesn’t sound much but still means 24mm over a 2440 board.

Colin

[Colin Crow]

Hi Dave

Only had my edge a short while too and been talking to the same people as you by the sound of it.

Have you read through the thermal printing guide yet? It was loaded onto my pc as a pdf file and explains a lot of what you are trying to do, inlay welds, traps, thick lines etc.

Its a bit heavy going but if you follow through the example it starts to make sense. I have to say Cadlink have been brilliant everytime I have rang or emailed them so if you get realy stuck I am sure they can help.

Good luck

Colin

[Colin Crow]

David,

Re emailing you direct – sorry don’t have your address

Colin

[Colin Crow]

David

Holding the CTL while dragging to leave a copy is exactly right – use it all the time, however it’s best used with a constrain key (shift on flexi) to leave an aligned copy. It also works with the cursor keys, so holding CTL and tapping a cursor key produces a copy one cursor position distant, in whichever direction was pushed.

The fly outs on programs like Coreldraw for example allow you to hover and release the left button to select alternative. They also allow you to select the shown tool with one click, not two. At the moment to select the text tool i click once on the text tool and the fly-out shows both text and kerning tools, I then have to click the text tool again to select.

I am sure my other issues will be solved once I am more familar with the product but I will email you re version 7 – thanks

Colin

[Colin Crow]

quote mrsticker:

reading this lot makes me ask why are you spending all this money on this software all you do is moan about it.

chris

It came with an edge package and looked a lot easier to use the Omega – although I still don’t have version 7 yet!

[Colin Crow]

quote David Evans:

Colin@BECC,

I would be interested to know what features you miss in Signlab from Flexi.

Best regards

-David Evans
Printing products manager
Cadlink Technology

To be fair I am still finding my way around am missing some of the shortcuts which probably exist elsewhere but off the top of my head:
Holding CTL key to drag a copy with mouse or cursor
The toggle zoom button
The fly-out menus drive me nuts that you have to click twice (I am starting to customise these now though)
Multi copies menu (e6 version seems a little flaky and always reverts to 1 if any other features altered after)

However, support from Cadlink has been superb (which is just as well as Spandex engineers know very little) and I am sure given another 5 years I will know this software backwards as well!

One serious omission though – I am told that Omega has the ability to slew the print/cut on the edge to align the edge with the plotter but signlab has no equivalent. I am still having problems with alignment of my GS15+ plotter and it has been suggested this may help.

Any suggestions?

Colin

[Colin Crow]

When I’ve got stuck with this problem in the past I have ended up printing to laser from word, scanning and then vectorising the bitmap. However, Flexi’s vectorising program is sooo much better than Corel 11 so depending on the complexity this might not be feasible.

Good luck

Col

[Colin Crow]

There is a brilliant little program we have been using for a couple of years called second copy which will back up any part of your hard drive to another local drive or networked drive at any time you specify. It can even just back-up modified files, certain directories etc. you can find it here:

http://www.centered.com/

Since having a hard drive just give up on my server, i now have second drives in every pc and at the end of the day they mirror the first so that when I have a problem i can boot from the spare. Once a week the document files get backed up across the network to an off site pc

[Colin Crow]

This is a bit big for us to produce! – our sister company produces flags for modelers up to about 400mm long. You could try:

http://www.mrflag.com

They do specials but unsure on price
good luck

Col

[Colin Crow]

What size flag do you need? and is an unusual design?

[Colin Crow]

Not sure how accurate this but one of the paint makers Miata says this

British Racing Green (1991/2001) PMS 5535

hope this helps

[Colin Crow]

We have been using Flexi sign pro for 8 years and found it brilliant for cutting but limited compared to corel/photoshop for image editing. It has some odd methods of operation which are a hangover from Amicable Inds porting it straight from the Mac version but nothing you can’t get used to. Support from Granthams has always been reliable too.

Recently got Signlabe6 with an edge package and already missing some of the flexi features!

[Colin Crow]

I’m new to signlab myself, but I have found when importing files from Flexi and other AIs signlab thinks that the curves haven’t been “closed” and consequently will not fill them. I have had this problem with older versions of coreldraw. If you select the wireframe and choose close paths from the drop down menu, it then takes on the fill colour.

I might not be your prob, but its worth a look.

[Colin Crow]

Thanks Big G, This has been driving me nuts all weekend. It sounds like I need to call Spandex tomorrow. If necessary i will get them to bring their envision along again to see if that fairs better. They first sent the GSX+ in error, so i didn’t get the GS15+ until last thursday. I was wondering if the stepper motors in this cutter were not as accurate as the servos in the envision but I can’t find any data on the resolution of these cutters.

Cheers, Col

[Colin Crow]

A bleed isnt possible with what i need to produce as the contour cut forms the outline around each letter. If the cut is out of reg then the outline turns into a shadow. I know you cant get absolute registration, whats more worrying is that it varies from one letter to the next over a very small distance on the vinyl.

None of the samples cut during the demo varied. They wern’t always spot on but they were the same across the sheet, not variable as I’m getting.

When you cut small decals does the cut move around within the bleed area you set?

[Colin Crow]

Sounds like a similar problem I have had with my SC650. It could be the front sensor faulty or loose. Check the small led on the cutting bed about 250mm from right hand side. It should be lit when working (dimly) and detects the front edge when measuring the vinyl. If not the vinyl just keeps rolling of until the end! I could cure mine temporarily by tapping directly on the bed over the sensor. It took the engineer loads of attempts to find the faulty cable and solve it though. Mutoh will do servicing direct, but ours is covered by contract. If you email me I will get the details of the repair company from the file. I know they work direct because they always try to charge me on each visit.