[John Childs]

Not me I’m afraid.

Although I’m sure that I have seen the bottom one before, but haven’t got a clue where.

[John Childs]

quote Phill:

I can’t decide if this is for real or an April fool Joke

Who knows.

Although, if true, I would wonder whether there was more to it. It is unlikely that she would receive the maximum fine for a first offence.

Although nothing surprises me any more. 🙁

[John Childs]

quote Phill:

I’ve never claimed 2wd was superior – that was Peter and John

Oi Fenton!!!

I never said two wheel drive was superior. Why would I be running around in a Range Rover if I thought that?

All I said was that tyre type played a very large part in snow and mud performance. And that’s as true for four wheel drive as two.

:nana: :nana: :nana: :nana: :nana:

[John Childs]

If he’s using Apple Mail, there’s a tick box for "PC friendly files".

Like you say Harry, it’s gotta be at his end.

[John Childs]

Did you get sorted Dave?

[John Childs]

quote Simon Polakof:

would it be okay with you if we took this conversation byt mail?

Or give me a call.

[John Childs]

The files have been sent back David, but I gotta go now so, if you still have problems, perhaps you could take up Ray’s kind offer.

[John Childs]

I will be happy to do it Dave, but you’ll need to be quick. I’m off to France after lunch. 😀

[John Childs]

Specialisation has worked for me.

By concentrating on one thing, getting all the procedures right, so that all parts of the process are working at an optimum level, then you can produce your product better and cheaper than anyone else. Optimisation even extends to workshop layout. Get it all right and you give yourself the all-important competitive advantage.

Of course, the reverse is also true. Because of our focus on vehicles we cannot make signs effectively, and many of you out there will eat us when it comes to quoting for them.

Andy has a valid point though and it can be very dangerous having all your eggs in one basket. It is absolutely imperative to have a plan to cope with difficult times, such as we have been experiencing over the last couple of years. I’ve got my plan, but I’m not telling you what it is. 😀

[John Childs]

quote Matty Goodwin:

Totally agree John, plus they look better and make better coffee!

Actually Matt, our best tea maker is Danny, plus he looks better than some of the girls we’ve had working here. 😀

Physical power isn’t an issue in this case because we are only looking for someone in the office to make the decals, not to apply them, or erect signs.

Time off can be annoying, certainly, but, again, the girl’s attitude is usually better. If they have to do it we get something like, "I can’t come in this morning because little Kyle is ill, but my Mum can look after him this afternoon, so I’ll be in after lunch". A lad in the same circumstances would just take the whole day off without a thought for the carnage he is leaving behind him.

Pregnancy can be an issue too, and we’ve had that more than once, but we’ve been lucky and it’s happened when we were able to work around it. That’s not to say that will always be the case of course.

On the whole I think I prefer the female, although it’s all academic, because we’re not allowed to make a decision based on gender. Are We? 😀

The point about the £1,000 for unemployed over six months is worth thinking about if you have two applicants of equal ability, but I’d be wary of making a decision based solely on that. Employees are expensive and the wrong one can soon offset that payment.

Finally, I need to talk to you about a possible job. If I’ve not been in touch by tomorrow lunchtime it means I’ve forgotten, so give me a call.

[John Childs]

Here you go Cheryl.

https://www.uksignboards.com/viewtopic.p … 34&start=0

[John Childs]

quote Gary Birch:

Will have to give it some consideration.

Worth thinking about Gary.

We once had one who was less than satisfactory but, in the main, our experience has been very good.

Young lads need choosing with a lot of care. The right one can be full of energy, keen to learn, and be a great asset to your business. They don’t come with previous bad habits and you can train them from day one in the way you want things done. On the other hand, most of them have expectations beyond their value, and maybe behavioural problems. You can waste a lot of time keeping them on the straight and narrow. My experience is that only one out of every ten will be any good.

Young mothers, however, tend to be old enough to have grown out of their youthful ways and have a lot better attitude to work. The success rate with those has been a lot higher and like I said, we have only ever had one reject get past the interview process.

[John Childs]

quote Martin:

When you feel the time has come to employ someone think about employing someone part time to start with, I know a number of signmakers who did that and it seemed to work out quite well for them.

I think that’s good advice.

We’re at the stage where we need someone to help out in the cutting room. The questions are: is there enough work for a full timer, and will this increase in workload last beyond the next few months? The solution is to advertise the job as part-time (with hours to suit) and a possibility of full time later.

In the past that has brought us in young mothers with children at school who only want to work from 9.00am until 3.00pm, and it has worked out very well for us. The thing is that, generally, you can get as much work done by a female in six hours as you can from a young lad in eight. They’re usually more conscientious too.

[John Childs]

I’m glad that you’re short of time after only three weeks in the business. That can’t be bad. 😀

I can only tell you what I did in your circumstances, and that was to be out most of the day seeing customers and fitting vans, then spending all night making stuff.

They were similar times then (recession) so I did that for as long as I physically could before starting my first employee. It was hard work, but I was a lot younger then. 😀

[John Childs]

Turned out very nice Peter.

As coincidence would have it, Peter M has just taken an order to do a couple of trailers next week. I’ll ask him to post up pics of them too.

[John Childs]

I didn’t take a lot of notice but, when in Doro this morning, I glimpsed out of the corner of my eye something about dry apply etch.

Might be worth giving them a call.

[John Childs]

quote Neil Davey:

Hope the cake is big enough for all the candles 😉

Better keep a fire extinguisher handy. 😀

[John Childs]

It may be a trend, but I’ve never liked it.

Some fonts aren’t too bad, but there’s a lot out there with different heights for letters and numbers. Helvetica and Myriad are a couple of examples. Now there may be some typographical reason for that, steeped in the mists of time, but to me they just look horrible with Tel or Fax in front of the number.

[John Childs]

Like Dave says, interesting thoughts Rob.

We had a meeting with a printer last night who has just had his monster UV flatbed installed, and I was surprised at the limitations.

For our line of work I think we’ll be sticking with solvent for some time to come.

[John Childs]

quote Harry Cleary:

the inmates are fighting again but they will settle down after feeding time! 😀

Well, after medication anyway. 😀

Hi Paul. 😀

[John Childs]

I need to brush up on my Taiwanese. 😀

[John Childs]

Well, according to my Pantone Bridge, PMS 208 is c16 m100 y35 k46.

RAL 4002 is quite a good match to PMS208. Little bit lighter maybe.

[John Childs]

We had another one yesterday.

The job is printing some panels to go on one of those outside catering trailers you see at events.

The customer has supplied panel sizes, which he assures us are within a couple of millimetres, but the designer tried to insist that we went to the trouble and expense of a site visit to double check them.

I explained that it wasn’t necessary because we would put about 10mm bleed on the prints anyway to allow for if the panels weren’t exactly square (been there before) so any slight measuring error would be immaterial. Do you think I could get him to understand that? No chance. 🙁

As an aside he said, "well if you go to see the trailer you can take some photographs for us". Get your fat ass off your chair, get out of your flash London office, and go take your own fecking photos. 👿

[John Childs]

quote Ruairi O’Boyle:

The supplier assures me the both machines will work fine for print and cut

In that case, I don’t know the difference.

I will say that our FXs are good solid reliable industrial quality machines.

[John Childs]

Illustrator again, but I’d use the scissor tool to cut the path, then just drop the node down a tad, then join.

Love the new avatar Jilly. Halloween was it? 😀

[John Childs]

I don’t know for sure, but suspect that the SX doesn’t have the optical gubbins which you need for contour cutting.

Both mine are FXs. One 1370mm and one 760mm.

[John Childs]

quote Ruairi O’Boyle:

JV3 and separate cutter ordered.

I think you’ve made the right decision Ruari, although I think you meant JV33.

Like Peter, I had a JV3 and separate cutter. They certainly suited the type of work we do, and the way we work. Come the day we replaced with JV33 and another cutter.

[John Childs]

It’s been taken down now. Shame.

I liked the "tramp stamp" bit as well. 😀

[John Childs]

http://www.dorotape.co.uk

[John Childs]

Hi John.

So, the feller you bought the business from did a runner a bit swiftly then. Does that tell you something?

Only joking. Welcome to the forum. 😀

[John Childs]

Here you go Adrian.

Check the font of the "takasagi chain" though. It came up as Arial, but wasn’t outlined, so I can’t vouch for the accuracy of that.

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Attachments:

RK_Takasago_Chain.eps

[John Childs]

quote Phill:

Fumes never did me any harm :pink: *hair*

Obviously. :rofl:

[John Childs]

Fumes are not a problem as long as they are vented. An extractor fan is best, but a simple vent is adequate in most cases.

The important thing, whichever you decide to do, is that either solution is installed close to the ground. This is because ink fumes are heavier than air, and sink towards the floor.

Also, when choosing ink types don’t forget that, just because an ink has no odour, that it isn’t harmful. Because of that I would always recommend venting of some form.

[John Childs]

quote Alan Drury:

I’m not sure we’re going to meet on this one John:)

I think you’re right there Alan. 😀

And I do appreciate that what an individual is used to plays a large part in their preference.

I do worry a bit about Tim running both systems side by side because, when difficulties arise, the temptation is always to run back to what you know, rather than get to grips with the problem. I think a better strategy would be to struggle for a couple of weeks until he gets fully up to speed with Illy, but I’m sure that Tim is aware of that and will make the effort.

Finally, automatic cars are easier. All our four wheeled vehicles are auto, even our works van. I’ve always preferred them and a recent relapse to a manual (Dodge Nitro) just reinforced what I knew all along, and I will never buy a manual again. 😀

[John Childs]

Alan,

I don’t think that the superiority (that sounds a bit over the top, but I don’t think that betterness is a proper word) of the Mac is obvious from a demo in a shop. It takes a bit of use before you suddenly realise how much easier everything is with a Mac. It starts with initial set-up, transferring files and settings from your old computer, and so on, which you don’t see because the demo machine is already up and running.

It goes on with adding peripherals like external discs, monitors, printers etc. All those software discs that come with those bits of kit and need installing. With a Mac you just throw them away because, when you plug in anything and switch it on, it just works. I bought some CCTV cameras last week and just connected them up, switched them on, and Hey Presto, pictures on my screen. It doesn’t get any easier than that.

Have a word with Peter Mindham. When he came here he was a dyed-in-the-wool PC man, but I think you’ll find he’s changed his opinion now. Ask him particularly about how long it took him to install MicroSoft Office on both types of computer.

With a bit of familiarity Macs are easier to use and maintain, but that’s a bit more subjective, so pointless discussing it here.

I also don’t think that an equivalent spec Mac is more expensive than a PC when all the features are taken into account and costed.

Back to software. It used to be that Illy was the professional tool and Corel the amateur equivalent, the sort of thing bought by the likes of local authorities who thought that they could save money by doing their own artwork and printing their own flyers. That has changed somewhat and, like you say, some excellent work is produced with Corel these days. Nevertheless, there is still some hangover and as I said above, you never see Corel files coming out of design or marketing agencies.

Perhaps I’m a bit more sensitive to that than many, because dealing with files produced by others is a large part of my life. If someone’s main work is producing and processing files which they have generated themselves, then it doesn’t matter what they use as long as it gets the results.

Just look at the file conversion threads, and see who needs help the most often. I think I can guarantee that it won’t be a Mac user with Illustrator. I can only remember asking for help once, and that was with a MicroSoft Works file produced by a local taxi driver’s son. 👿

[John Childs]

quote Shane Drew:

how did I know you’d say that :lol1:

Probably ‘cos you’ve seen the inside of my wine cellar. 😎

[John Childs]

Are you going Nik? I think I owe you a drink. 😎

[John Childs]

quote Glenn Sharp:

I’ve never used Illustrator Jason……in what way is it superior to Corel?

Glenn, I’m not going to get into a feature by feature comparison. You would need somebody who uses both alongside each other, and is a lot more familiar with both sides of the coin than me.

I don’t doubt that Corel is a good piece of software, and will do the job admirably for most signmakers, but I would say that I have never seen a Corel file come out of any design or marketing studio.

Like it, or not, Illustrator is the professional standard.

[John Childs]

quote Jason Davies:

Just make the move to illustrator, an industry standard and far superior to Corel (just my opinion) (:) (:) (:)

:yes1:

[John Childs]

I’m not quite with you on this one Peter.

My opinion is that insurance companies sell us a product in a competitive market, have to survive in the real world, and are subject to the same rules of business as the rest of us. I happily accept that some folks treat insurance companies as fair game, but I would never do it.

Local authorities work entirely differently. They decide what they want to do, work out what their plans are going to cost, then send us the bill. We have no choice in the matter and are legally obliged to pay whatever they tell us.

[John Childs]

quote garyh:

he got a habit of buying everyone drinks on company at parties

I don’t see the problem. 😀

[John Childs]

quote Brian Little:

i just being silly 😀 .

You’re being silly. That’s the sort of thing that only private business has to do.

Public employees think that our customers have a legal obligation to pay whatever prices we demand. Because that’s the way it works in their world.

[John Childs]

quote Paul-D:

drop me a mail harry and i will see what i can do with it for you….

And if that doesn’t work, I’d be happy to have a look.

[John Childs]

I don’t have a problem with the council tip. My twin strategies are:-

1. Send Jenny, or any other female who possesses the ability to cry on demand.

2. Send my old dad, who tells them that he’s just been diagnosed with something terminal, and he’s clearing out all his rubbish so that his children aren’t left with the mess when he’s gone. Oh, and he feels a bit faint, so could someone help him empty the van please?

Ethical? Maybe not, but those thieving cheating layabouts on the council lie through their teeth to me all the time, so I don’t feel guilty about it at all. In fact I get a quiet satisfaction knowing that I’ve worked one over on them for a change. It makes me feel good for the rest of the day. 😀

As an aside, the council make it more and more difficult to dispose of rubbish, then complain about the increase of fly-tipping. What on earth did those Einsteins think was going to happen? :headbang2:

[John Childs]

I’ll be there Wednesday.

[John Childs]

Glad you’re on the mend Mike. 😮

[John Childs]

Morning Gavin.

I don’t think any of us like "tel", but Jill is a little more sensitive than most! 😀

The thing is that it is entirely superfluous, so what’s the point of putting it in front of what is obviously a telephone number.

Sometimes the customer insists, but i always ask them if their customers are so stupid that they wouldn’t recognise a telephone number when they saw one. Only once have I had the reply, "well, yes they are". 😀

My personal gripe is a long list of contact details. Phone number, fax number, mobile number, web addy, email addy, and so on. To me that just looks, a) cr@p, b) unprofessional, and c) like they’re desperate. I reckon phone number and web addy is more than enough

[John Childs]

Nope. Corel stopped doing Mac versions about ten years ago.

There’s no answer for you really because although there are various ways a Mac can emulate a PC very nicely, it brings you back to the wonderful world of Windows.

With the recent upsurge of Mac market share I wouldn’t be surprised if Corel doesn’t make a return to the platform, but who knows how far away that might be.

Changing to Illustrator might be a solution, but that would involve a learning curve, which you might not want.

[John Childs]

I’d be somewhere in the middle. Around £2750 plus VAT.

[John Childs]

quote John Harding:

don’t get your Catholic and Protestant mixed up

There’s no mistaking Paddy’s Wigwam. 😀

[John Childs]

Well, we don’t get it quite that bad Peter, although some customers (that’s customers, not graphic designers) can sometimes be a little demanding.

We usually put up with it because of the volume of business we are chasing, and certainly wouldn’t get involved in all that for three poxy little signs.

[John Childs]

quote Colin Crow:

If you need a contact for the Mimaki speak to Emma at Isub digital

:yes1:

[John Childs]

Liver birds.

Deffo.

[John Childs]

Oops.

Posted in wrong place. 😳

[John Childs]

Ruari,

I guess it depends on the length of the prints you might be called upon to do, but we couldn’t live without a take-up. There’d be print all over the floor with the inky sides sticking to each other. I dread to think how much waste we would generate.

My comparison knowledge of the different printer makes is limited but, from my experience of Mimaki, I’d go with them, even without the price advantage.

[John Childs]

quote Ian Johnston:

quote John Childs:

quote John Cooper:

So that’s it then – Morgan Cars 😀

Ownership may have changed since I last looked, but the largest British car manufacturer used to be Manganese Bronze.

They make London taxis. 😕

sold to GEELY today

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/b … 066364.ece

D’oh !!!

[John Childs]

quote Stuart Green:

Would it then be okay to have a call out charge to deter customers from not bringing the vehicle to you??

I don’t think that would work in my case. It would be a psychological problem for my customers

What you can do though is to offer them a bit of discount to bring the van to you. After all, you did put a lump into your quote to allow for working on-site didn’t you? So if you’re not incurring that expense you can knock it off and be no worse off, whilst the customer thinks he is saving money.

No. Hang on. He IS saving money, so everyone’s a winner.

[John Childs]

Hello Jason. :welcome:

[John Childs]

quote Richard Martin:

Just because someone may start a business with 100k won’t make them any better or anymore succesful than someone who starts out with a thousand pounds but who may actually know what they are the doing.

That’s absolutely correct.

It’s absolutely impossible to generalise because some really serious people have started up in this business with cheap equipment, and turn out work far superior to mine.

However, the fact remains that the advent of pocket money machinery has allowed in the other sort as well. Those that see signmaking as an easy quick buck, those that don’t care what damage they cause to the industry by lowering standards and price expectations and so on. They are also the ones that come on here and take everything they can without making a worthwhile contribution themselves.

On the other hand, no guarantee, but you can be fairly sure that someone who has invested £100k is fairly serious.

The conclusion I have reached is that I will help those who, by their actions and words, appear to be making every effort to become serious signmakers, whilst ignoring those who are just interested in picking our brains for their own ends.

[John Childs]

quote KW:

I use to do the same. But when you do this for clients they always expect the same level of service and also expect you you to be at their beck and call. I found I made a rod for my own back.

That’s right, and I had exactly the same when I got my first premises.

You won’t change the routine with existing customers overnight, but you can make a start by saying things like, "certainly, we’d be pleased to do your van tomorrow, but I can only do that if you bring it here. If it must be dome at your place then the soonest I can get away is next Tuesday". Once you get them started down that route then it’s surprising how quickly it becomes the norm.

We still work on-site, but only when we have to, or when it suits us. However, I still think it should be avoided wherever possible. Firstly there is Phill’s point about being away from your workshop and missing phone calls, along with casual callers. My thing is the actual cost of an employee’s time and the vehicle expense once they leave base. That’s not insignificant.

[John Childs]

quote John Cooper:

So that’s it then – Morgan Cars 😀

Ownership may have changed since I last looked, but the largest British car manufacturer used to be Manganese Bronze.

They make London taxis. 😕

[John Childs]

Hi Ebrahim, and welcome. 😀

[John Childs]

B

A if we have to, and travelling costs, and other on-site working expenses, are paid.

[John Childs]

Hi Mark. 😀

[John Childs]

quote Phill:

Can you think of any other benefits that buying signs bring to your customers?

Not really.

I’m firmly convinced that the vast majority of signs go unread.

but don’t tell my customers

[John Childs]

quote Dave Rowland:

John T, I am glad someone recognized the place!

Oh, I recognised it but, as you were referring to it as home, I thought I’d better say nothing.

It’d be cheaper living at the Savoy mate! 😀

[John Childs]

Nice old building Derek. I much prefer that sort of thing to a modern tin box.

Only a small part of mine is older, and only then dating back to the mid fifties when it started life as a transport cafe, but the floor tiles are brilliant and I doubt that i could get anything anywhere near as good done today without spending mega-bucks.

[John Childs]

Here’s me. 😀

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Attachments:

[John Childs]

Well, what about fabricating some clamps to go around the pillars, then fixing a rigid pole between the clamps?

Or maybe you could work out a way of fixing a rigid pole to some of the banding used on plate and post type signs.

[John Childs]

Cheers Dave. Mucho appreciated. 😀

And Steve – I was doing it while you were posting. 😀

[John Childs]

:sigh:

………

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Attachments:

[John Childs]

No doubt somebody will tell us that Google have missed their street, but it seems a thorough job to me. Tiny little roads around here, that I wouldn’t have thought they’d bother with, are all in there.

[John Childs]

quote Steve McAdie:

Chewbacca, I’ve always got a ( oh i swore ).

Nah. I think Martin Cole has cornered the Chewbacca market.

Karl, Blake’s Seven? Glynis Barber? Weak at the knees? Me?

Oh yes. 😀

[John Childs]

Try this one Shaun.

https://www.uksignboards.com/viewtopic.p … 09&start=0

Search further and you will find other threads with photos of the festivities.

Have patience Glasshopper. 😀

[John Childs]

Well, the two computers nearest the camera look like mine, but that’s where the resemblance ends.

Sorry lads. 😀

[John Childs]

quote Peter Normington:

No reason you have to wait for Rob to book your ticket Dave 😀

Especially as he told us that he’s only coming up for the day. 😀

[John Childs]

Hi James. 😀

[John Childs]

I’m with Andy. If you sold it to your customer, then it’s his, and not yours.

However, it might not be as simple as that, because the terms of the licence may not permit re-sale. I fact you have, in all likelihood, not even bought the font yourself, but merely a licence to use it.

If you want to be sure about this then you need to settle down for an hour or two with the small print. 😀

[John Childs]

I think you mean the bit where the head goes off to measure the width of the vinyl.

If so, I wouldn’t have thought you could do anything about that.

[John Childs]

quote Robert Lambie:

be careful IPA can easily be watered down as it is clear.

Good warning Rob.

I think our stuff is ok though because I try to be careful where I buy.

The chemical business is awash with thieves, villains and chancers. Those who take a generic substance, repackage into smaller containers, multiply the price by ten, then flog it to the likes of us as a specialist product. For an example, try comparing the price of orange glue remover from a sign related company with that charged by a proper chemical company.

Same with IPA. Avoid re-sellers, and buy from a reputable source. Even if they do sell on eBay. 😀

[John Childs]

IPA is available from quite a few sources on a well known auction site.

I can check the exact one we get ours from in the morning.

[John Childs]

This is what I meant Harry. No second bench anywhere.

Added on edit: Oh, bugger. Can’t read the words. Oh well……

The top one is what I think we are discussing.

Middle is the way I did it when I started, with cutter sitting on the end of the bench.

Bottom is the way we have one of our cutters set up today. Not too often used like that, but can be very useful sometimes.

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Attachments:

[John Childs]

It’s expensive if it’s only 4mm.

I can’t check what we pay until I go into the office, but it’s nothing like that.

[John Childs]

My first set-up did exactly the same, with the vinyl coming off the cutter and straight across the weeding bench. It was forced on me to a certain extent due to a lack of space, but worked well for some years.

I never had a problem with lack of gravity, but then my cutter only took 500mm wide vinyl. It was sprocket fed as well, so slippage problems couldn’t occur.

Even today one of our cutters has a gap only just wide enough for the operator to squeeze through. Provided we are careful to leave a bit of slack it is perfectly possible to start weeding whilst the cutter is still doing it’s business.

Added on edit: You don’t need two benches. Off the roll, through the cutter and onto the bench. Simples. 😀

[John Childs]

PU55Y !!!!!

Sorry. Couldn’t resist. 😛

[John Childs]

quote Adam Ross:

For some reason in corel the box tick box for exporting with a transparent background in not available

Oh dear.

I can’t help then – you need a Corel guru.

I’m sure that one will be along shortly. 😀

[John Childs]

quote Adam Ross:

I would like to remove the white rectangular background from a circular jpg photo is this method suitable for that ?

I guess it depends on the file.

In Illustrator we just export the file as a jpeg with a transparent background and that leaves just the image.

Do it all the time with jpegs lifted from customer’s websites when doing rough van visuals.

[John Childs]

quote David-Foster-:

I remember my first job in an Architects Office plan printing with ammonia! The paper had a yellow coating, the drawing was on tracing paper, you ran it through a UV light exposing the plan, then run the yellow paper through the ammonia tray, then hang the prints up to dry! :lol1:

We used the same system at my first job, working in the drawing office at the York Trailer Company. Wow, it seems like forty years ago now.

Hang on a minute – it WAS forty years ago. 🙁 😀

[John Childs]

quote Peter Normington:

what do other do?

Use Macs. 😛

You have got to be really class A stupid to let a virus into a Mac.

[John Childs]

The obscure font scam is brilliant, been aware of it for years, but we don’t use it enough.

I’ve got a beauty, one specified by a client some years ago, and costing £250.00 for one weight. I know that I should use it all the time, so that bodyshops and the like had no option but to come to us for replacements, and we could charge anything we like.

The trouble is that it is such a butt ugly font that I can’t bring myself to inflict it on another customer. 🙁

[John Childs]

quote Lorraine Clinch:

I haven’t included vectorisation in my ‘cheap’ quote.

I’ll continue my search for a website

Lorraine, how much time are you going to waste looking for a website, and how does that convert into money?

Fair enough, you’ve quoted too low, but it wouldn’t cost a great deal to get that digitised, and might be cheaper to swallow the cost than waste a lot of time in which you could be doing chargeable work.

Food for thought. 😀

[John Childs]

quote Jeremy Howes:

If designing was so easy and profitable, what are we all doing making signs?

That’s an easy one Jeremy. Because I’m not a designer, and I don’t pretend to be one. All I’m any good for is for transforming somebody else’s ideas so that they work on vans efficiently. 😀

But the thing is that most of the designers that I come across are no better than am I. The difference is that they charge ten times (no exaggeration) what I would. And get away with it because they are better salesmen.

And as far as the client is concerned the designers design will always be better than mine. It must be because it costs more. 😕

Of course not all designers are bad, they’re just the target for today. It’s not all one sided because I’m sure we all know some cr@p signmakers. I’m aware of one in particular whose work is absolute rubbish and I wouldn’t trust him to stick a stamp on, but he does the vehicles for a major blue-chip company. He tells all sorts of lies to cover up his bad work, and they believe him every time and let him carry on. It’s incredible and I can only think that he is either sleeping with the right person, or brown envelopes are changing hands. Certainly skill doesn’t enter the equation anywhere.

[John Childs]

quote Jeremy Howes:

Instead of the rant, wouldn’t it be a better idea to get to know your local designers?

Our local designers aren’t my problem Jeremy. We have a lovely young lady who, having been shown what we need, comes up with the goods every time. Other locals we find that we can talk to, and they help if they can.

No, my rant is against the larger agencies, the ones that charge the end user well into five figures, and sometimes six, and put themselves up as being the be-all and end-all of the design world. The ones who, if they lived up to their big talk, really ought to know better.

My experience is that, having done a re-brand or marketing campaign, and having been paid for it, those people consider their job done, and will not lift a finger to help without submitting another large invoice to somebody.

Of course, the end user has swallowed all their guff about how good they are and, having expended his budget, is reluctant to pay again for something he thinks, rightly, he should have received already.

[John Childs]

quote Nigel Hindley:

We have eps’ that come in at 40mb that should around 100k how they get them that big is beyond me!

Not to me it’s not.

We have had crappy 72dpi images sent to us and, when we ask if anything of a higher resolution is available, they just re-save the original crappy image at a higher res. So, instead of one pixel being defined by, say, 16 bytes of file, it is now 256 bytes.

But it’s still one pixel and doesn’t print any better from a 40 meg file as it did from the original 100k.

D’oh. 🙄

[John Childs]

quote Jon Marshall:

But how many times have you had vector artwork from designers that is a mess of strokes and masked off sections?

All the time Jon because, again, they are stuck in their own little print world and have little understanding of other techniques.

But at least that’s only important if we are going to cut vinyl. For print we can scale those files up to whatever size we want and print straight from them.

We have on occasion done a job in print, where we would normally have used vinyl, simply because it was easier than sorting out their file.

[John Childs]

quote Gwaredd Steele:

They don’t want to pay that’s the trouble.

Yeah, it’s funny how they always seem to be prepared to pay big bucks for a fancy marketing agency to come up with these specifications, and then choke on their coffee when they find out the implications. I’ve lost count of the number of times I’ve seen these folks specify a ten year vinyl on a three year lease van. Stupid.

In a case like this I would do what you are doing – find an equivalent. I would then send them a sample and get their approval in writing for the substitution.

I would forget the Pantone and RAL codes. Firstly, the two codes for each colour are contradictory and don’t even match each other and, secondly, it will be better to try and match a vinyl to a vinyl.

I think that 3M 220 series is cheaper than the 100. My 100 series swatch give the equivalent in 220 series, so that would be my first port of call

100-14 = 220-14
100-724 = 220-197

Failing that I would again ignore the Pantone and RAL and match the 100 series swatch to an alternative. I would suggest:-

100-14 = Avery 722 Light Orange
100-724 = Avery789 Ink Blue.

Again, get it in writing because although those colours are a good match to their 3M spec, they are slightly different to the PMS and RAL ones. Just make sure that they know what they are getting up front, and are happy with it.

Hope that helps.

[John Childs]

quote Gwaredd Steele:

Ooh, that 100 series is not cheap is it!!! :lol1:

Nope.

But if it’s what they specify, then it’s what they want and they must be prepared to pay the price. 😀

[John Childs]

What you say is fair and reasonable Mr. Normington, but my experience is that graphic designers generally just don’t think of vans and signs when they are producing artwork for somebodies new corporate image, and therefore don’t produce the right files.

All they think of is business cards, letterheads and brochures, and it never crosses their minds that a logo might need to be produced at something more than an inch high.

Do it in vector and it’s bombproof. We can manipulate the image into any size or format that is appropriate for the job. It doesn’t work the other way round and we have no opportunity to make up for their shortcomings.

[John Childs]

Hi Geoff. 😀

[John Childs]

quote Jillbeans:

You need about a half hour for the show. I probably could get by with 15 minutes because I am not interested in machines.
4 hours in the show pub.
3 in the hotel pub.
At least one overnight, and about 3 days to get rid of the hangover.

Yay!!!!! :cheer: :cheer: :cheer: :cheer: :cheer: Sounds about right, except that I don’t get hangovers. 😀

For me the show is more about the opportunity to meet, mingle, and exchange ideas and experiences with my colleagues than to look at boring sign stuff.

Or, as one of our less dignified members once put it, a p1ss-up with a sign show attached. 😀

Wouldn’t miss it. 😀