Wrapping a vehicle in Oracal 751, advice please?

[David Hammond]

We wrapped this logo using 751 years ago.

From memory it grabbed like hell on initial contact, but we still see it bobbing around doesn’t appear to have failed.

Have you checked out their 970 range for a colour?

---

Attachments:

[Daniel Evans]

HI David

Nice job, I checked the 970RA swatch but the greens are very limiting, got the colour in 751 but I can see it being a bugger to fit.

[David Hammond]

I wont lie there was a few tantrums thrown doing that one 😆 But hadn’t been at it long when we tried this one

The flat parts are OK, it’s just really thin. Depending on the amount of coverage and the design, I’d be tempted to take the hit on the cost of the 3m, rather than struggle working with 751.

[Daniel Evans]

Thanks David

Here’s the design, ignore the rear doors.

The design is simple enough i think.

Seeing as the 751 is only 1200mm wide, I’m trying to work out where to have the joins as well

---

Attachments:

[David Hammond]

I’d not worry to much about the joins they’re inevitable.

Should be possible if you do vertical drops, you can work the air out of the recess, use knifeless tape for the cutting.

[Simon Worrall]

quote David Hammond:

I’d be tempted to take the hit on the cost of the 3m, rather than struggle working with 751.

Couldnt agree more David. Most of the cost of a colour wrap is the time taken to apply it.
751 is good cast film, but I would sooner laminate it onto an air release base first and then wrap that if your struggling to match the colour..
Anyway, good luck with it. Keep us posted on how you get on. :smiles:

[Daniel Evans]

Not a bad shout Simon. How does that work if I laminated the 751 into mdx? Different materials, both cast, that would work wouldn’t it and be a more cost effective solution especially as I have the mdx in-stock.

Also where would you out join lines?

[Simon Worrall]

Sorry not familiar with MDX so I couldn’t say.
I have used ij180 digital wrap film as an air release base for 3M 7725, and it works a treat.

[Kevin Mahoney]

quote Daniel Evans:

Not a bad shout Simon. How does that work if I laminated the 751 into mdx? Different materials, both cast, that would work wouldn’t it and be a more cost effective solution especially as I have the mdx in-stock.

Also where would you out join lines?

Careful there, I’m not sure MDX is a true cast, I think it’s a hybrid, maximum manufacturing width for cast is 1525mm, MDX is available at 1600mm. May be why it’s half the price of Avery or 3M

[Robert Lambie]

I thought MDX was a calendared polymeric??

[David Stevenson]

Used mdx on 7 citroen relays, almost every recess popped out!

[Kevin Mahoney]

They market it as a wrap film as long as it’s flat-ish, a glorified MD5 in my opinion. I don’t think they call it a cast but apparently it shares some of the cast manufacturing process.
My experience of using it although limited, I wasn’t tempted into buying another roll. It’s a soft polymeric, never to be confused with a cast wrap at double the price.

[Daniel Evans]

Thanks guys, I thought it was a cast, not sure where I got that from.

Ok maybe not laminate on to that then, I have some Avery cast in stock so could maybe use that or attempt it without, I might do a trial as I have the van for a few days and some 751 in stock.

[Denise Goodfellow]

Have a look at Metamark’s m7 range, some even come in bubble free

[Daniel Evans]

Good shout but I don’t think that will handle the recesses, unless I tuck in and maybe put a join there

[David Hammond]

They market it as CC (Cylinder Cast) and they also do a small range of coloured wrap films MD-CC. It’s ok, reminds me a bit of the Mactac tuning film.

An alternative may be Hexis, who do a true cast wrap film.

[Daniel Evans]

I originally had hexis but they discontinued the colour about 6 months after changing my clients fleet.

I’ve used the cc colour range and to be fair that went on great and still looks good now. I was a bit worried about it as it was a really old tatty van with primer on some parts etc, I told the client I won’t warranty it and they were fine.

The only think is it’s a bit opaque so you can see a colour shift where the primer was.

[David Hammond]

I’ve specified Hexis a few times, only to call and place the order to find they had no stock, and long lead times.

[Daniel Evans]

Yep, stopped using them unless I have no other option

[Barry Smith]

quote Daniel Evans:

Thanks David

Here’s the design, ignore the rear doors.

The design is simple enough i think.

Seeing as the 751 is only 1200mm wide, I’m trying to work out where to have the joins as well

can you not print the colour?
Tweak the design, add a gradient into the green, show it to client, they may prefer it.
I’d also drop the swoosh to below the door handle, saves a lot of messing about removing them, I would personally only use a wrap film, better to do the job once, than have it come back after a few weeks for failing, and have to eventually revert to a wrap film, the cost of the roll may not cover this job, but will pay for itself on the next few vans.

[Daniel Evans]

Not at the moment, waiting for a new head to get installed.

I did think about outsourcing but by the time it comes back to me, me head would have been installed but I’d rather just get the job in and out so tempted to take a hit and go with 1080.

Had a play about with 751 earlier though and although I’ve never used it as a wrapping film and neither would I want to if the colour was available in 970 but it’s not that bad to put on, not as tacky as I thought.

[Chris Wilson]

quote Daniel Evans:

Thanks guys, I thought it was a cast, not sure where I got that from.

Ok maybe not laminate on to that then, I have some Avery cast in stock so could maybe use that or attempt it without, I might do a trial as I have the van for a few days and some 751 in stock.

It’s a “cylinder” cast.
So I would image it’s made on a roll but is or was a liquid so effectively a polymeric that’s had a bit of Boil.

And I can agree it doesn’t like a relay recess. Buy cheap buy twice ay. It does have its uses though.

[Robert Lambie]

quote Chris Wilson:

quote Daniel Evans:

Thanks guys, I thought it was a cast, not sure where I got that from.

Ok maybe not laminate on to that then, I have some Avery cast in stock so could maybe use that or attempt it without, I might do a trial as I have the van for a few days and some 751 in stock.

It’s a “cylinder” cast.
So I would image it’s made on a roll but is or was a liquid so effectively a polymeric that’s had a bit of Boil.

And I can agree it doesn’t like a relay recess. Buy cheap buy twice ay. It does have its uses though.

I would be interested in what a cylindered cast was or should I say the process. I haven’t heard of it before…
I know calendered films are like a pizza dough compressed between various steel rollers till flat… (cylinders?) and cast is like paint being poured onto a table and leveling in a relaxed state.
so… a cylindered cast?

[Kevin Mahoney]

A new one on me too, there doesn’t seem to be a great deal of information out there on manufacturing processes, either it’s a very closely guarded secret or its far too complicated for mere mortals to understand. I’m led to believe That if it starts life as a liquid & is cast into its final shape, I guess it’s a cast, hence the name. If it begins with a dough & goes through a series of rollers, it’s a calendered film. Spandex have one out, i’m giving it a whirl this week, if it goes well I’ll post some pictures.

[Simon Worrall]

Here’s the process:
$this->BBvideo_pass(‘$8’, ‘$4’, ‘$7’)

[Kevin Mahoney]

Can kind of see why they want so much money for the stuff, I bet that’s a few quids worth of kit

[Daniel Evans]

So my printhead is due to get fitted on Wednesday so with the bank holiday, I’ll hold off and print it instead.

I’m tempted to try with the 751 one day though lol

[Kevin Mahoney]

Maybe worth looking at this as an option Dan. We wrapped this van today in a soft polymeric from Spandex. A bit grabby to fit but half the price of wrap & apparently designed for single step recesses. Seems ok so far…

---

Attachments:

[Richard Urquhart]

I have had great success using non air release 751 with the clear app tape applied to the face, I can’t explain why but it allows it to be fitted with easy and no bubbles, remove the clear and heat in the parts you need

[Richard Urquhart]

I’m not saying it’s a wrap film and it grabs like help but it needs must works

[James Martin]

Did this outside in the cold which was helpfull as it doesn’t grab as much.

---

Attachments:

[Chris Wool]

been following these 751 threads with some interest as years ago we fell for all the manufactures hype about 751 and started using 751 metallic colours all failed miserably by cracking up, fading. non metallic appeared ok
even lettering on a flat surface the higher up the side of the van the worse it was, presumed to be poor uv resistance, as we got very little interest from suppliers and no help so guess what i think of it.
remember last year striped a van for a customer all the ip5700 that was all in good condition came off clean the 751 was a nightmare.

[Daniel Evans]

Hi Chris

I’ve used 751 for the past 3 years, not on all jobs mind you but I and never had an issue with it other than being really really tacky in the summer months when fitting.

I did have one job last year I had to re do as it blistered like **** but I put that down to the sun beaming down on it when fitting. When I re-done it a few days later in a cooler environment, it went on great.

[Chris Wool]

yes agree but this was a metallic only problem and did not show up till 12 to 18 months after fitting

---

Attachments:

[Daniel Evans]

Wow, I use the charcoal metallic a lot and not had one issue with that and been using that for ever but mainly on smaller items.

[Robert Lambie]

I have mostly used Oracal for the past 18 years.
751 was originally a polymeric calendered vinyl. It handled, applied, weeded, cut excellently…
Oracal later upgraded the 751 to 751c when they changed it to a Cast film and introduced 551 polymeric to take its place.
Cast films are known as a more difficult to install vinyl in comparison to poly/monomeric calendered films.
the film is thinner, adhesive can be more aggressive, overall a more temperamental film to apply. for instance, in warm weather, the adhesive becomes "much more" aggressive and the film becomes very stretchy, causes creases and micro-bubbles. In cold weather, the film can become brittle and snap easily, or if applied to glass which is colder again, it shatters… in both instances much worse if no application tape has been applied.
However, cast films have very little shrinkage once applied, so conforms much better over irregular shapes, recesses, rivets etc. colour stability is much higher and casts tend to have a much higher spectrum of colours to choose from than calendered films.

Now that said, I personally would "never" try and replace a proper wrapping film with a general cast like 751c to save some money. not only will the application take you much longer. when it comes to removing the film from the vehicle it may be an absolute nightmare taking 2-3 times as long as the actual installation, and when done, the vehicle may be left matted in the adhesive residue taking you longer again. this is not just 751c but Cast films in general.

Oracal 751c is not the top cast in the Oracal range, that is Oracal 951… with Oracal 970 & 970RA (rapid air) as Cast Wrapping film.

[Paul Smallbone]

Interesting topic.

Totally agree with you there Robert.

Plus standard cast vinyls are a nightmare to remove.