Where do you work from?

[Russ]

the out going costs seem good, in this case prehaps give it a go if it’s got under your skin, better to have loved and lost and all that mumbo jumbo.
I work from home and have no plans of changing except every time some nutter knocks on the living room window at 10pm on a sunday night.

Russ

[John Singh]

I work from home simply for the ease and convenience.

However if I was looking at £100 per week with rent and rates
I might seriously look at that – because at the end of the day it does put you in the open more to local business.

Of course, then you will need someone to man (woman) the counter whilst you get on with the signmaking 🙄

[Robert Lambie]

costs etc as you have stated id go with the shop, but make it inviting. seen some sign shops open and ide not bother knocking on the door with the nik their own work is in. 🙄
£100 a week is easy covered, your out the missus way, no mess and your establishing something. if costs where higher ide say stay put for a bit yet… having a shop normally means you need to sell a ton of budget type signs to make good money.

go for a clean sharp image, dont over power it with “look what i can do” type signs… by the time you have the fascia, windows done then all the ineterior stuff the front screams “let me breath” :lol1:

best of luck mate, im sure if anyone, you can pull it off 😉

[Ramj]

if you have professional looking and quality signs, you’ll probably do enough to warrant a move to somewhere bigger at some point, but then you’ll be able to afford it, I say go for the shop

[Joe McNamara]

thanks for the replies lads…

Even though I can easily cover the costs due to other contract work, I appreciate the reassurance.

Like I said earlier,
I’ve had industrial units before, so I don’t know what I’m worried about..I think a high street type presence will be so much better ( well about 1/4 mile off the end of the high st. but the same road ).

Thanks again for the replies.

Cheers
Joe

PS i fecked up the poll ’cause I put the same option in twice!
….eejit

[David Rowland]

it just working space that is the issue to be honest.
Outside vehicle work, if you can figure that then should be no real reason why not.

[Phill Fenton]

I’m not sure Joe….

What type of business are you hoping to attract? A shop unit can be very time consuming with a lot of “incidental” work – Number plates, house signs, etc.

If your market is business to business sales I’d be saying get an industrial unit. But you have had experience of working from an industrial unit before and are presumably not convinced that this would be your best option.

Personally I find the type of enquiry you get from “passing trade” or the general public to be much less profitable than working for other small businesses. I often find myself being irritated by the nature of many general public enquiries we receive – and I imagine that this would be many times worse if we were based in a shop unit.

If you are intending to service the business to business sector I think you will be better off renting an industrial unit.

Just my opinion

[Lynn Normington]

I /we prefer to work from home, but that sounds like a really good deal, you say parking for about 7 motors but is that just to shop or could you sign or tint them there ?

Lynn

[Joe McNamara]

Thanks for the input Phil,

I can understand your frustration with members of the public with their passing enquiries, but the shop will be directed mostly at trade stuff – ie small businesses in the area.

If it comes off we’ll do numberplates and all that but, like yourself, I won’t tolerate messers.

The front of house will have price boards on display ( price per sq ft, 1 colour, 2 colour etc + % for graphic etc ) so if I get price shoppers in they can figure it out themselves !!

I think a visible shop type presence will be far better than an industrial unit………….as an example, there are 2 very well known shop type locations in Bristol, that are well organised and do good business. Now, ask anyone in Bristol whether they know of a sign place and 99% will know of one of these two locations.

There must be 200 other companies in industrial estates that don’t get this type of recognition.

Maybe for a big business to business type sign company, an industrial site is good, but, it takes a long time to build and for people to find you, and you need to have a good advertising budget .

I know you’re successful in your location Phil, you do nice work, charge accordingly, and good luck to you, but I’m looking for the easier type work for the shop – simple foamex boards, banners, window lettering, and vehicles, and garment printing – and not having to chase some accounts department for a few grand 60 days after I’ve done a job, been there and done that!

Cheers
Joe

[Lee Ballard]

We operate from home currently but given the costs you mention, I’d say go for the shop.

Lee

[Joe McNamara]

Thanks again for the replies all.

I’ve just read through some of my replies and they may sound a bit conceited to some, but it’s very hard to convey a chat in text if you like!….

So apologies if I come across like that – it’s not the case at all! 🙂

I am leaning more and more towards the shop as I can promote engraving and embroidery from it as well (both farmed out) , as well as pushing garment printing a bit more and blowing the dust off the old heat press.

There isin’t a facility for doing vans outside really ( although I could I suppose ) but I’ve been mobile doing them for the last few months so that really isin’t an issue in my book.

As a further example, a credit card size advert in our local paper is £120 + vat for one week, so even as an advert for the business, the shopfront seems like good value.

I’ve had a look at the other shops as well (sign shops) and every time I’ve passed them at whatever time, there has always been a customer in them, or a van being lettered out the front.

Cheers
Joe

[Hugh Potter]

i think the shop has it’s advantages,

this is an issue i’ve been thinking of for a bit now, i’m running out of space here, and taking on bigger jobs which i sometmes have to work on outside !

i know about 5 sign shops around here, two on industrial estates (purely cos i’ve passed them for years), and the other three i’ve only noticed in the last couple of years or so, and thats cos they’re either shops, or next to a main road,

the passing trade must be phenominal, especially on the more main routes in and out of town, lorries, vans, bosses, workers, everyone ! they’ll all pass and remember you if the front is eye catching,

personally, whilst i like the bigger jobs because i can use my time more efficiently, there is alot to be said for people who want clip art type stuff doing, i made around £400 (more i think) on a two day show, near all of it was cut from offcuts from bigger jobs, worked total of about 10hrs,,

in my short experience, those little jobs will fill in between the bigger jobs ! and because someone takes on the little jobs, means someone like me doesnt get fed up with waiting and then buy his own machine and become competition a year or so later !

an ind unit has its benefits of course, size, noisability (new word), ready made customer base around you, etc. but if its not in a prominent place, i think you may struggle without a good advertising budget.

good luck in whatever you do though.

Hugh

[Phill Fenton]

I have one customer who taxes and tests a “signed up” car simply to be able to park it on a busy main road and advertise her business (a childrens nursery). She tells me the car is a much cheaper way to advertise than using other means. It’s on a very busy main road heading into Edinburgh.

There’s a lot to be said for the high profile a shop gives you – especially if it’s on a busy main road, so without a doubt this will raise your profile as long as you are not swamped with price shoppers and tedious enquiries that can tie up too much of your time without resulting in good profitable work.

[John Gregson]

Hi Joe,
Its definitly got to be the shop – at those overheads its not even worth worrying about. With a good sign outside you will receive passing trade and free advertising, just think how much we plow into the pockets of the Yellow pages/local papers every year. I would offer small qty stationary / invites, T ‘shirts and promo items to draw in the punters and this in its self would pay the bills – easily done on a good plotter/heatpress/laser printer/guillotine. I’ve got a large unit at the back of an ind. est. and get no passing trade at all. When customers do eventually find me, even for the little jobs they come back time after time. To attract more of these customers I am looking for a shop front too! the only draw back I can see is it has to be staffed at all times ie 9 – 5 because customers wont come back if its closed, they’ll look else where. As for the time wasters, I would still take their money, some of my best clients started out as not having a clue on what they wanted to purchase. A real time waster now could turn out to pay your overheads in the future.
Cheers John

[Jayne Marsh]

The only drawback with a shop is that you will need someone in from 9am till 5pm as people will expect it to be open shop hours so that they can stroll in when they feel like it. I know a local company who work from a shop in the main high street and they seem to be doing very well, but they do get alot of time wasters, i.e. people coming in just to have a look. On the whole though I think its probably a good idea, I work from home and have no overheads and my customers like to think that they are getting one to one personal service, but the draw back is that its hard getting your name out there and people think they can ring late at night or any time on the weekend.

[Rod Gray]

Another aspect to give some consideration to is looking at a shop or premises with a view to buying it….not simply renting it.

Renting should always be the last option.

£400.00 a month could go a long way to paying a mortgage and 10 – 15 years from now you `ll find yourself with a nicely growing asset instead of having paid a fortune to some landlord`s retirement fund.

Seriously consider property to purchase instead of renting if you are able to.

[Joe McNamara]

Thanks for all the help and replies everyone – you’ve all been a big help as usual.

I spoke to the owner today to do the deal……..and he’s only gone and rented it to someone else 👿

Marvellous isin’t it, I thought I had it if I wanted it ( after a chat with him last week, and he’s gone and rented it to someone who’s opening a “general” shop!

Hopefully it won’t last long and I’ll get it next time round.

Learnt my lesson though, need to be quick when you get offered a bargain!

Cheers and thanks for the replies again lads and ladies!

Cheers
Joe

[Rob Brearley]

just be careful about the rates as well joe, you need to ask the rateable value of the whole of it including the upstairs if you have one as i got stung by the council for that now my rates are larger than i first thought, i learnt that lesson on the 2nd shop….personally i tend to agree with others that a unit is better, but understand your reason for the shop however i am constantly asked for directions and how much for 1 sticker??? after a while it gets annoying especially when you are on the phone and stand there waiting for you to ask a direction 👿 but on the other hand we are opposite a cafe which is open 7 days a week, so as we do print, signs and printed workwear/t-shirts etc we can generally hit the builders/plumbers/gardeners who come in from there with stationery-workwear or a van sign if not all 3 which i may not of had if i wasnt there??? but if i had my chance again i would have opted for the unit in all honesty with a big yellow pages ad in a couple of areas, sorry if this is not much help to you joe i know it sounds like sitting on the fence but could you not ask him for a short term lease? oh yeh and ask for 3 months rent free so you can do it up to how you want you will be suprised how many landlords will accept it, i got 3 months on my first shop and 4 months free on the second as it was empty for a while so well worth asking 🙄

[Rob Brearley]

sorry joe i forgot to say in the begining i know he has leased it but i meant the messege in case your still on the lookout for a shop :lol1: :lol1:

[Scott Evans]

I wouldn’t work from a shop where I am because for such a small place (Torquay), there is an awful lot of competition. When my father owned a sign business in the early 80’s he had a large unit because he had a lot of staff and needed the room, now really you should ask yourself these two questions:

a) Do you need more room? If you believe you are not taking on bigger jobs because of the hassle of having a lack of space then go for the shop because you may improve profits due to the additional work you can undertake. If you do not need more space then that’s a tick in the ‘stay at home’ box

b) Now this is an important one. I believe the main reason you want the shop is because it is in a place where the shop front will work as advertisement for your business. Will you having the shop boost trade enough and more to cover the additional costs of rent and bills? If it is just the advertisement the location provides then perhaps you should just consider better advertising your business. Would it be cheaper to hire a bill board in a prominent position, advertise in your local or on-line than to lease a shop where you have rent, rates, electrics, ALL the redecoration of the shop to represent your business in an inviting manner and other mounting bills that eats into profits that are currently enjoying the freedom of going virtually straight to pocket (after tax lol).

So really its a simple question, do you believe (because everything is a gamble) that the obtaining of this store will increase business enough to pay the additional bills AND more importantly make you more money for the hassle? If yes, then go for it, if no then I think the adverts might be better for you.

[idgni]

we work form my fathers farm yard. in what used to an old cow shed and milking parlour. my main fabrication takes place in a disused mushroom poly tunnel. (would post picture but can’t attach here)
As the company has grown we have taken over nearly 9000 sq ft of workspace on the farm.
we are right in the middle of no-were but find it’s not passing trade that pays (probably as we don’t get much passing trade in the sticks :lol1: )
but customer recommendations that brings the work in. Our biggest contract to date being over £300,000.00. solely through reputation. (ps. this particular customer has never visited my FACTORY. and gets the usual, HOLD ON UNTIL I PASS YOU THROUGH TO THAT DEPARTMENT :lol1: .

I my eyes location is nothing. PRODUCT is every thing

LOOK at my posting in PICTURE forum to see what can be achieved from humble premises ( Signs & Graphics:WE CARE)

[Checkers]

Your location really depends the business your pursuing and/or your marketing plan. Do you want retail consumers or business people? You need to focus on one or the other because trying to pursue both can cause you to loose focus and do more harm for your business than good.
As idgni pointed out, you don’t need a retail location or storefront if you’re pursuing business relationships, as long as you market yourself well in other ways. Word of mouth is good, but you also should use direct mail, email and websites, outdoor advertising and other forms of self promotion.
To keep my overhead low, I’m starting off as a home based business, with a plan to move to a new location within a few years. In the mean time, I am starting to market my business and tracking where my clients come from and how they found me. This information will tell me what is the best form of advertising for my business and help me decide on where and what type my new location will be.

Cheers,

Checkers
a.k.a. Brian Born
Harrisburg, PA USA