wall fixings for banner poles ?

[Peter Normington]

Hugh it seems odd that the architect is worried about damage to the brickwork, if you used expanding rawlbolts. they are fine unless the bricks are old and crumbling, and then no form of fixing is suitable.

How old is he building? and do you know what is under the rendering?

standard brick is 100mm so you couldnt go 120mm anyway.even if you add 15 for render.

http://www.rawlplug.co.uk gives specs etc.

Peter

[Paul Hughes]

hi Hugh

Ive not used the chemically fix bolts so have no view, i normally use the normal raw bolts only ever had one job go wrong with them and it was a real old building and the bricks were very very soft and broke up when you did the bolts up. took all day to fix 3 bolts 👿

i have used the other bolts you mention, i found that if they were not going into new or very hard (engineering brick) brick they were pretty useless and i gave up trying to use them, may have just been me 🙁

good luck with the job hope it goes well, and is not as windy as it is here right now, them banners make for good sails 😀

Paul

[Martin Pearson]

Hugh, this is a bit confussing, they are happy for you to drill holes for chemical fixings but not to fit expanding rawbolts?
Sorry but what is the difference. The damage to the brickwork is going to be the same no matter what sort of fixing you use.
As Peter has said standard rawlbolts are fine for this sort of job, I would personally use a heavier bolt than you are using though. If you are drilling a 10mm hole you must be using M6 bolts. Don’t know how big these banners are as you havent said but for these I normally use a M10 bolt which would require a 14mm hole I think.

[George Elsmore]

I have done this sort of job with rawl bolts i have also used 10mm x 90mm coach bolts and plugs and i drive past them every day still there 18 months later as said before damage to bricks?? a hole is a hole is a hole and if they are chemi fixed think about the probs if they ever wish to remove 😕

just my humble opinion

George

[ANDREW S]

I’m with George on the coach bolts – a much more simple fixing 😛

[Hugh Potter]

thanks guys,

Martin, difference is… rawlbolts (or those with an expanding sheath) put pressure outwards, quite alot of it, chemically fixed bolts do not, ya drill the hole, blow out al the dust, half fill the hole with the chem fix stuff, and wind in a length of studded rod, the chemfix adheres to both the brickwork and the bolt threads,

i personally would like to use the rawlbolts, years ago i put up a 35ft cb ariel on a 20ft pole, on brackets that held it away from the wall by 15″, that was about ten years ago, and it’s still there ! that was with rawlbolts, the pull pressure on them must’ve been huge in some of the storms we’ve had over those years,

i think chem bolts will be fine for ‘shear’ strength, but i’m more concerned with the leverage being put on them,

just got off the phone with the architect, he reckons there’s 20mm render and then the brick, told him i’d like to use the chem fix, but will let him nkow for sure after i do the test hole, looks like i’ll go with rawl bolts anyways,

banner btw is 1200 x 600 double sided, 12mm bolts.

[Robert Lambie]

quick reply, what size is this banner hugh?

[Hugh Potter]

hi rob,

banner btw is 1200 x 600 portrait

[Andy Gorman]

I would think some kind of expanding bolt would do the job. Similarly to Hugh, I fitted 2 brackets holding a 20 foot steel scaffold pole with a BIG Ham radio mast on top using those bolts that have a nut on the end which pulls the little thing through the middle. (Yeah, really good description Andy!). This was 20 years ago and it is as solid as ever.

Something like this: http://www.screwfix.com/app/sfd/cat/pro … 5&id=14258

Curiously, I am doing a 4′ x 2′ banner in exactly the same way as you describe next week.

[Hugh Potter]

thats the fella’s i wanted to go with originally, seem to me that they’d have a much stronger grip than chemfix which only sticks to a hole you’ve drilled, great for a flat sign / shear strength, but the expanding bolt / stud type must be stronger for supporting a protruding sign of some kind !

thanks Andy !

[Alex Wilson]

We fitted a 3m x 1m banner system from banner box a few years ago with chemical fixings into a fairly soft red brick after a similar unit fitted with rawlbolts was blown down in bad weather. (not fitted by us 😀 )
Chemical fix gives you a much more solid fixing than rawlbolts. You would need to allow for the chemical resin to set and in can take up to five hours in cold weather
Good luck with the installation

Alex

[Hugh Potter]

well not i’m really confused !!!

my main concern is that this is over people walking below, i have tried and trusted experience with rawlbolts, and these are big rawl bolts, expanding at the rear of the sheath, if one of the babies pulls out, i’ll be with several bricks still attached,

i understand how the chem fixings work, and also very basic physics, hence they just dont fill me with confidence with regards to a horizontal force.

ie,

try to pull a 22mm+ metal cone thru a brick with an 18mm round hole. get ten people on it and pull as hard as ya like, that cone aint going thru,

now do the same with a 1/2″ round plug of hard goo on a pourous surface…… the same brick, it may well be tight, but the fact that its not bigger than the hole it sits in means that ultimately it could still come thru with enough applied force,