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Vinyl Peeling Problems
Hi everyone, ive recently supplied and fitted full printed graphics to a fleet of 4 vans, this is a repeat customer the last 4 vans had exactly the same design on them and lasted 3 years until the lease ran out no problem, the company has now got 4 new vans on lease and i have done exactly the same design, print and process, the only difference been my supplier.
my problem is every van has now started to fail and peel on each corner of the prints. the process i go through is as follows.designs and print everything for the vans due in.
leave to hang dry for minimum 48hrs
laminate
book the vehicles in 2/3 days later
clean the vehicles with water/soap then surface cleaner including dooe shuts and trims
fit the graphics.
Job Done.Am i missing anything here, ive done 100’s of vans this way and never had any issues.
any help is appretiated.
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17 Replies
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Sorry for all the questions but need to ask?
Do you have photos of the fails?
What type of Vehicle and what area of the vehicle are the prints on?
Is this a wrap application or flat surface?
Where they fitted outside or inside?
What temperature, was it cold or hot?
what vinyl’s are you using?
what laminate are you using?
What Surface Cleaner are you using? -
hi thanks for the reply
Do you have photos of the fails? yes i have a few ill upload later
What type of Vehicle and what area of the vehicle are the prints on? they are all 2015 peugeot partner vans
Is this a wrap application or flat surface? its the flat panels where the windows should be
Where they fitted outside or inside? they were fitted inside
What temperature, was it cold or hot? it was around 18 degrees inside
what vinyl’s are you using? the vinyl is hexis hx3000
what laminate are you using? laminate is hexis v650b clear gloss
What Surface Cleaner are you using? i use hexis No 13 surface cleaner -
I think it best seeing the pictures before commenting more mate as it would be purely guess work now.
try getting pictures close and at an angle if possible. as its really hard to tell how a fail has happened just from a front on distance shot. 😀when you say fail, do you mean de-laminate or just the corners are dog earing?
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its the corners are dog earing, the laminate is fine, both layers are stuck together perfect.
http://i899.photobucket.com/albums/ac19 … ya2dws.jpg
http://i899.photobucket.com/albums/ac19 … zfzrjw.jpg
http://i899.photobucket.com/albums/ac19 … hjiv8c.jpg
http://i899.photobucket.com/albums/ac19 … vdy2vb.jpg
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I can’t see where you gone wrong to be honest. Only problem could be needed more of a clean because as you know on new vehicles have the possibility of polish on the paint work and maybe but I doubt it, maybe not cleaned enough in the first place. It is worth mentioning it to hexis. Wish I knew mate but maybe more heat is needed and pressure again doubt it as your no newbie.
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Thanks for the reply, yes im talking to hexis about it at the min, but dont want to kick a fuss up about it, id just like to get to the bottom of the issue so i can get the job out knowing its not going to come back.
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If you’re printing solid black that could be a problem. I think with that ink load it can take a lot longer to gas off. I’m not even confident really heavy ink will completely gas off at all. If it’s still not fully degassed and then it is cut, it can roll back.
Also that is a monomeric vinyl and ‘promotional’ laminate.
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Hi
i would have said solvent curl or laminate contracting causing a curlKev
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thanks for the reply guys, the bit thats confusing me is why the equivalant metamark monomeric vinyl lasted 3 years no problem.
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Hi
what profile did you use when printing?Kev
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We had a similar problem when we filed in te panels of our vivaro.
We printed again, then sealed he edges with a sealer pen
Hexix used.
It’s been fine since
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Just a thought:
I have more than once received a file from a gormless designer who had used REGISTRATION colour instead of black in Illustrator.
What that does is print all four inks at 100%.
What that means is that you get four times the maximum ink load, and it never dries(!)
there was once so much ink on the print that it formed a ripple and ran down the vinyl.
Is this possible in your case?
Simon -
your problems come from monomeric vinyl that you use for something it is not planned for + heavy ink coverage (+maybe inappropriate profile) + too much tension while laminating.
"thanks for the reply guys, the bit thats confusing me is why the equivalant metamark monomeric vinyl lasted 3 years no problem." : consider that your lucky in using something that is not intended for this purpose and that it last more than expected.
Look at the glue left on the car panels on the border of the vinyl: your vinyl shrunk a lot (inappropriate vinyl + heavy ink coverage), that would not be sellable at my shop.
Use the right film for the right application, don’t try to save pennies, it’s not worth it.
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Got to agree with others
This is a combination of using a monomeric film with potentially heavy ink load i.e. 4 colour Black, insufficient outgassing for the ink load and potentially too much tension on lamination.
Regarding MD3 working previously compared to Hexis 3000 is like comparing one car make to another …. they’re all made of metal, have rubber tyres and use fuel to go but the performance can be completely different dependent on the quality of the raw materials and manufacturing methods.
I’m not saying there’s anything wrong with Hexis 3000 or Metamark MD3 – For that matter I wouldn’t recommend any of our customers use 3M IJ25 monomeric for a 3 year vehicle application – The problem is product choice and vinyl manufacturers constantly over positioning lifetime on their spec sheets that leads to the wrong product being used.
A 3 year flat vehicle application should be a polymeric film every time. I constantly have this battle with manufacturers. Some even specify its unprinted life of up to 5 years for a monomeric … what use is that to anyone buying a print film ??
We would always advise monomeric for promotional short term use only, realistically up to 12 to 18 months max outside, as you will experience shrinkage and adhesive exposure after this time. Polymeric for up to 3 years outdoor (some will push up to 5 years) and Cast for anything longer or any application that requires stressing the film (heat stretching, wrapping etc)
I know many printers/sign companies will push the manufacturers spec sheets to the limits but if you want hassle free production then always stay on the conservative side of a spec.
The difference in cost of raw material between Polymeric and Monomeric is probably less than £0.75 per sqm for the base film and same for laminate. Worth if you’re producing several hundred sqm for a short term job but not worth the risk on a few sq m at the limit (or beyond) of its designed use.
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This may be a problem with the laminate too tight in the machine. We had a problem with this a few years ago.
If the laminate is tight coming off the the roll, it will stretch and and first will seem fine but after a time the laminate shrinks back pulling on the vinyl. -
sorry for the late reply everyone, been a bit busy last few days,
the print is definitly black ink and not all 4 at once,
do you all use a 7 year vinyl or a cast film for your prints?
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Got to agree with previous posts, would only use a monomeric film for promo work / short term advertising on a vehicle.
Plus the MD3 has an acrylic adhesive whereas I’m pretty sure the hexis does not.
In answer to your question, yes we always use a polymeric or cast vinyl on vehicle work, it’s not worth the risk.
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