Van Graphics: Guardian

[magpie]

They look so good I’ve kept them for reference. Excellent one man fitting too.

Cheers, Pete.

[Bill Dewison]

Top job Shane 😀 Looks really good!

Out of interest, what made you choose 851 for that job, most of it looks as if 751 would’ve done the job?

Cheers, Dewi

[Robert Lambie]

hi Shane, another iveco? 😮 bet you were NOT glad to see them after the large digi printed one you did? :lol1:

anyway, vans look great, well fitted to from what i can see. 😉

how are you finding 851?
I HAVE SOME TO PLAY WITH BUT HAVEN’T REALLY HAD MUCH CHANCE TO GIVE IT A REAL caps 😕 test… maybe i should do a product test on it soon? 🙄
anyway, how does it feel to work with, how well does it stretch?
like dewi says, 751 would (& does) cope well on ivecos, reason i know is we do them lots for a large contract we have and i mould the 751 into the recesses without any bother. been doing that 2 years and haven’t had a come back yet. (touch wood :o)
anyway, if 751 does it, 851 will eat and spit the job 😉

thanks for taking the time to post your work mate, always great stuff 😀

[Dave Bruce]

quote :

we do them lots for a large contract we have and i mould the 751 into the recesses without any bother. been doing that 2 years and haven’t had a come back yet. (touch wood :o)

Rob R you sure, be honest now, do I have to get the photos out?

Dave

[Robert Lambie]

dont follow mate, we have letterd more than 300 vans for GAP plant in the last year or so. many of these are IVECO daily swb & lwb. we only deal with the head office, so if any of the branches had bother with vinyls on their vehicles we would be pulled up pronto? 😕

[Dave Bruce]

sorry Rob I was thinking of another big contract you have, but not Ivecos

Cheers

Dave

[John Singh]

Great job Shane

and three cheers for the Graphic Designers!

(Now can we (:) them)

[Robert Lambie]

dave by any chance this is OBAN milk? :lol1:

[Nicola McIntosh]

talking of milk!! 😛

rob did you do the wisemans range rover?

reason i’m asking it passed my front gate on the main road..first look i thought ‘why is that range rover got primer patches’? it’s a new car..then i noticed the wiseman logo i thought it looked cute!! 😀

Nik

[Robert Lambie]

:lol1: :lol1: we dont produce the graphics or choose the vinyl, but yes, we do “some” trucks for wiseman dairys. we did 6 two months ago, fit only. 😉
infact i did only 2 andrew and another fitter did the other 4. i maybe wrong but i think they were in avery vinyl.

[Dave Bruce]

good guess Rob

[John Singh]

I think I can remember a little about this
Can’t remember what the problem was though
Didn’t you show us some photos of this Rob

OK who churned this one up?

[Dave Bruce]

think it was a bit of a white wash

but Robs been creaming it for years

😳 Dave

[Robert Lambie]

Oban Milk is a supplier/distributor of grahams milk, but other than that it is “not” connected.
When Oban bought a sprinter van around a year ago, they approached grahams to have it lettered by their sign company (us) at grahams expense!
Of course grahams agreed, but when they approached us, they wanted rock bottom prices!
To do this van the way I wished, was to use MACtac , MACfleet vinyl. (Vehicle wrap)
Not only would we be charging far more than what they pay for their own large trucks, the vehicle would have to be located on our premises “not theirs” and for 24hrs!
The answer from them was a firm NO!
This was a freebie for them!
So what do you do? What you have is a wrap! No way around it, as it is a contract customer you want to help in any way you can.
We dropped the price as much as we could but there was no way round the vinyl used or the time/location.
Still not happy… they wanted what we had used on all their recent vehicles as that was also an exact colour match!
751? I knew fine well, this was not an advisable material for the job given. None the less…
They insisted that we crop the design we gave down to eliminate some of the curves etc and wrapped the recesses. Doing all this in 751?

Anyway, after signed faxes asking us to do this we obliged against our advice.

2 months later oban milk contacted us “direct” asking could we repair some popping out of the work. My answer (like grahams dairy) was a firm no! If we did it would be charged by the hour, including travelling rates. To this day it has never been attended.
Dave, correct me if im wrong, but this vehicle has had this problem for some time now?

The worst possible thing that came of this 1 vehicle from a fleet of around 130!
Was 6 months or so after it, grahams bought 4 sprinters. Same scenario, but NO reports of the same results!
To this day (even though they cant) Grahams have never came back to us to voice any sort of complaint.

As a sign company, we can only advise our customers on the best, if our customer insists we use what they say, what can we do?

For the record Dave:
Ide ask anyone to contact most, if not all, Vehicle wrap suppliers and ask how well their “vehicle wrap” stays put in the recess of a sprinter van or an old shape transit? (and if they say, “YEH SURE”will they garuantee it? 😉 )
I think you will find that the most common complaint to ANY vehicle wrap supplier is that these DEEP type of recesses cause problems. Now that’s a wrap vinyl!!! Purposely made for this type of application… and still problems arrise. What was used on this instance was 751, not a wrap, not a cast, but a 7 year calendar! And in my opinion coped extremely well…

Back too intial post to shane, I would still point out that, 751 is just as capable as 851 on recesses like this. (IVECO daily) but MUST be fitted in the proper Vehcile wrap fashion. 😀

[John Singh]

Well that just about wraps it for me Rob

Bit of a cow that job then by the sounds of it
no problems with the udder vehicles I see

There were expecting to tan your hide but you sure covered yourself by getting them to sign the faxes

Sent them back with their empties

Well done

[Andy Gorman]

Come on John, moooooove along now.

[Nicola McIntosh]

and a pat… on the back for you two!! 😀

Nik

[Carrie Brown]

You did a great job Shane :thumbup2:

Carrie & Stephen 😀

John Singh, you make me :lol1: 😉

[Andy Gorman]

Sorry, I forgot to mention – excellent job there Shane. I love doing vans and you’ve done well for an old geezer. 😉

[Carrie Brown]

quote niknaxpc:

and a pat… on the back for you two!! 😀

Nik

:lol1: :lol1: Oh crikey its spreading … the nutty bug is going around!! 😉

Oh yeh Nik is it your birthday?

[John Singh]

Yeah fantastic Job Shane

Would have been alright for the photo shoot if some twit hadn’t stuck his fingers all over it 😕

John

[Robert Lambie]

silly john, thats finger rolls :lol1: :lol1:

sorry shane, just realised we piggy-backed your post mate 😕 😀

[Shane Drew]

Thanks every onew for your replies. I appreciate that as always. :lol1:

I used 851 because it is a cast primarily. Have had a few ‘popping’ incidents with 751 (although my own vehicle has been done with it) so I was a bit hesitant.

Until I discovered Oracal, I was a 3M 7725 user, and a 3M Control Tac user.

I was happy with the 851’s application, but I must be honest and say that I think it falls a bit short on application compared to 7725. 😕

It certainly does not stretch as easily over the deepest indents, (the top recess on the Iveco especially) and in fact it tore when doing the old wet finger trick. 7725 would have worked in this situation. A cut and shunt fixed it tho. When you heat it to try and conform areas, it shrivels instead of shrinks too, again, I can only compare this to 7725. 😥

No doubt it is what you get used to, and I certainly would not right it off, but by comparison to 751 I think it is certainly easier to use and apply. 🙂

I have a sample here (don’t tell anyone as it is a secret!) of the new 751 cast material. I have tested it against jobs that I normally used 7725 for, and I am reasonably confident to predict that it is exactly the same face stock. It feels like 7725, it looks like 7725, it weeds like 7725 – me thinks it is 7725. 😎

Anyway, thanks again for your replies. Got slighlty off track there eh, but it was an interesting read. End of the day, I think you guys are one crazy bunch! I love the humerous banter. It makes this site unique 😉

Cheers
Shane

[John Singh]

751 cast!!!

Did you say cast?

[John Singh]

So when is this supposed to happen and are they thinking of increasing the cost per m

Think there’s an obvious answer to that

John

[Shane Drew]

quote johnalphasign:

So when is this supposed to happen and are they thinking of increasing the cost per m

Think there’s an obvious answer to that

John

John, the talk is that they are thinking of dropping the 851 and replacing it with the new 751, and keeping the cost down too.

The expected release date is toward the middle of this year.

Cheers
Shane

[Dave Bruce]

Yer nice job Shane, well done, a bit more interesting than your average text on a van.

Rob, you are right, I saw the van a couple of weeks after it was done and the vinyl was all split along the top edge recess. I know I had been warned not to even wrap a sprinters recesses, so I apreciate your situation. Yep, I know what customers are like, give me some gold at the price of tin, especially up here on the west cost, mostly full of pensioners trying to save their pennies, and ofcourse most people live of the short tourist season so don’t have too much money to play with. If the competition is £5 cheaper than me with the same spec sign then they would go there, fortunately I make better signs and have better knowledge then they do so I usually win even when I am more expensive.
Rambling a bit now. I was just teasing you a wee bit there, you know I love your work and have alot of respect for what you do, it is fantastic.

Didn’t mean to give you a leathering
Perhaps I am talking a load of bull, so I will take my leave and retire to the byre.

Apologies from me Shane

Dave

[Shane Drew]

No worries Dave.

I know what you mean about being dumped for a buck.

I have actually lost a job because I was actually $5 to dear! 😮

I don’t live in a tourist area, but a low socio-economic area. They would do anything to save $5 so they can put it toward the next packet of cigs!

I do very little work locally, but when I do it is usually because someone else has had a go and done a dud job in the first place. Only then price is not usually an issue.

Cheers Mate.

(what is a byre?)

[Robert Lambie]

quote :

I was just teasing you a wee bit there

:lol1: :lol1: :lol1: know worries dave, i knew you were mate 😉
to be honest, if you, or anyone else knows/thinks im talking bull, your perfectly right to question me 😀
thing is, in my position i cant afford to advise the wrong product for the job. as many will know by now, i wont comment/advise on a product that i dont use day to day, or have used. if i do i state that i havent used it but share my opinion on it & my reason why. thats about as much as i think can be expected of me. 😕 :lol1: :lol1: :lol1:

ive been using oracal for about 5 years, mixed with MACtac 9800. but mostly oracal in the past 3. never had any bother ever, “scouts honour” 😮 :lol1:

shane, intresting points… ive used loads of 3M control tac, i actually liked the rubber feel to it when wrapping with it. but i dont think i was ever 100% confident about it in sharp recesses. although i never had any problems with it, ive heard of many headaches around the country. to be honest, i think its main issues is the way some apply it. but thats another kettle of fish :lol1:
3M without a doubt do a top notch vinyl, with the price tag on it, they would have to 😉 :lol1: ive used various 3M vinyls, other than price, i cant really fault them. im saying price, based on buying lots for general sign work. just not economical to buy a material 2 & 3 times the price i pay for an equally as god vinyl, considering the application in hand. 😉

its also intresting to hear your finds on the new 751 in australia. 😀

[Dave Bruce]

Shane, a byre is the scottish word for cow shed/barn.

Cheers

Dave

[Shane Drew]

Rob,

The price difference is not that huge here between 851 and 7725. About $2 a metre I think for 610mm wide. 3M are losing market share here because Avery are being very aggressive with corporate work, and 3M have restructured their distribution network, sacking their most dedicated distributor after eons of service. They then took on Avery and moved their clients over to that brand. 3M are being very price competative as a result.

So it is not so much a question of price to me, more like supplier. I am ‘off’ 3M because they have this ‘attitude’ and they don’t give a stuff about anybody. Real holier than thou.

On the other hand, Oracals distributor here in queensland has set new benchmarks in service, and deserves support.

The control tac is a brilliant material, but like me with 851, it takes some getting used too. I did a half wrap to a fleet of 15 cars last month, and I would not have been happy doing it with anything else.

Due to 3M’s high profile in world leading technology, if I want to use 3M product, I sell it to the client as ‘leading edge technology’ and people seem to understand that they have to pay more.

Cheers
Shane

[Shane Drew]

quote DaveBruce:

Shane, a byre is the scottish word for cow shed/barn.

Cheers

Dave

Thanks mate, I have a hard enough time with aussie english, I am hopeless with scottish english 😳

Shane

[Andrew Bennett]

quote dsi:

Thanks mate, I have a hard enough time with aussie english, I am hopeless with scottish english 😳

Shane

And your the other side of the world 😀 😀

[Bill Dewison]

Reason I asked originally Shane is, like Robert, I’ve used 751 on quite deep recesses without any real hassles. I did have to work at it, but I’ve checked on the van recently and its as good as the day I fitted it.

As you say though, the price difference between the two vinyls, 751 & 851, isn’t massive. Just wondered why you’d gone for 851.

Cheers, Dewi

[Martin Pearson]

Nice job Shane, Simple clean and easy to understand.

Robert I think the main problems with materials like control tac are down to fitting as you say, some of that will be down to not preping the van properly and some will be down to bad or inexperienced fitting.

The companys that supply these vinyls dont help either, I dont know about control tac, but if you read the fitting instructions for macfleet or vws they both give you a dry and wet application method. Water as you no is the worst thing in the world when fitting vinyl in reccesses.

[Shane Drew]

quote johnalphasign:

So when is this supposed to happen and are they thinking of increasing the cost per m

Think there’s an obvious answer to that

John

John, got word today from my supplier that 751c (cast) has landed in australia now (most colours) with the rest arriving in about 6 weeks I think.

If they are shipping here, they are probably shipping there too. It may be worth a call to your suppliers to give it a go.

Price for 751c is going to be slightly dearer than 751 premium cal, in the short term anyway, until they get an established user base at least I’d suspect.

I am told 851 is not being discontinued either as I suggested, but they are adding the 751 cast to give a wider choice to us, the end user.

Cheers
Shane