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Sign Tray Fitting Questions
When using ‘L’ alloy for mounting a sign tray to a concrete wall.
What do you guys use for fixing it to the face of the wall?
What do you use for fixing the sign tray to the bracket?
Do you predrill the holes or do it up in the air?
Any tips be appreciated. I’ve got any idea in my head but would like any advice on how you guys do it.
I’m doing my first tray this weekend. 4 metres by 1 metre.
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20 Replies
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I always use to pre-drill everything if I could, much easier and probably more accurate done in the workshop and less time spent mucking about on site. For the Angle I just use to use normal plastic Rawlplugs if fitting to brick. For the tray itself either self tapping screws or rivets. Normally rivets as they are faster to fit on site and can be drilled out easy enough if the tray needs to come down at a latter date.
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Pretty much the same as Martin. Though I tend to drill the tray in workshop, put the tray on the brackets on site, mark the holes then drill the bracket in situ’ as it were. I only do this because if the wall is slightly out on the run it can effect your pre-drilled holes. I also normally rivet, especially if I’m high up and I want to get down quick, though beware kick back!
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A little tip that saves me time,
screw the angles to 2 pieces of timber at the exact distance apart so that you do not need to measure on site, that way all the holes can be pre-drilled
Peter
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Well done Peter, i forgot that bit, been a while since i have done one. It also ensures the two rails are square to each other.
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top tip peter.
just a thought i had two trays to do and the customer was told by the estates manager that i could only drill into the mortar.
like you guys i prefer to do as much as i can back in the work shop.
i also like to pop rivet .Derek
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thats a good tip peter, i gotta fit one up in the next week or two, so it’ll be interesting to use that one !
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Aye Peter that is a good tip! I’ve only done this on the last tray we fitted and was delighted with what I thought was my moment on genius! (oh well!)
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Thanks guys for your tips.
Thanks Peter for that tip.
Can I also use the angle ali instead of the wood and pop rivet it together?
Each section would look like this
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|__|__|Well the vertical pieces would be sitting on the inside of the top and bottom ASCII art for you 😛
I was going to make the frame in two 2×1 metre sections and dyna bolt them to the wall. Then I was going to use self taping screws to secure the sign tray to the frame
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yes , but the wood is only a temporary thing, once the angles are in place, the wood is removed. But there is no reason why you couldnt use alli to make a permanent frame, by fixing verticals between the horizontals
Peter
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Thanks peter.
If anyone wants to see the tray its here:
https://www.uksignboards.com/viewtopic.php?p=200012
Will have fitting photos in a few days.
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1. Drill 4mm, holes down the return (100mm in from each end and about 500mm apart).
2. Drill holes down one side of the fixing angle, roughly 500mm spacings.
3. Decide where you are fixing the sign and using a spirit level, line the angle on the wall and mark off the holes that are in it.
4. Drill and plug the wall then fix the angle.
5. Measure from the outside of the fixed angle and repeat 2,3 and 4. Your tray is 1000mm. If it’s made of 3mm aluminium then measure 990mm. This allows for the thickness of your material (X2) and allows a few mm clearance.
6. Place your tray over the angle and drill through the existing holes and through the angle using a 3mm drill bit.
7. Fix using 1"x8g screws. -
Hi Gents
Haven’t done any light boxes yet and wanted to know what do you guy’s do about the electrics and are they just plug in like a socket or wired in?.Also do you use a pricing scale like so much per sq/m
Cheers
Lee -
Lee Lightboxes don’t come with a plug on and are normally hardwired, if you don’t hold a 16th edition you are better off getting a sparky to wire it up for you. There are people who believe you can get round the regulations by putting a plug on the end and calling it a portable appliance but it would still fall under PAT testing regulations if you did that as far as I am aware.
I hold a current 16th edition certificate so do my own but I did use to get an electrician to do it for me to start with. -
Hi Martin
I would get someone to wire them for me, Although i do a lot of electrics helping a mate on re-wires so would be able to do it myself, Its not worth the trouble .Cheers
Lee -
Hi Martin, with regard’s 16th edition, I do have a electrical background but not certified, how did you find the certification process? and is there a minimal certification for doing fascia wiring? Not sure if this has been asked before but I am wondering if it is something a sign maker should look into for themselves.
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Dave, I spent 20 years in the Royal Navy as a mechanical engineer, mostly mechanical work obviously for which I had a lot of qualifications but it also included a fair bit of heavy electrics and even a bit of electronics work for which I had no qualifications for at all. When I was medically discharged I did an HND in mechatronics (electro-mechanical engineering) so I already had a pretty good knowledge of electrics.
To be honest I didn’t stop to think what a minimum qualification for the sign industry might be, I knew that 16th edition would ensure I was able to do the work I wanted to do so I just went to evening classes to do it. Most of it was a bit boring as I had already either done it before or picked it up elsewhere but I think it was worth going for the qualification which means that if I have a job to do I don’t have to worry about getting a quote from someone else to do work I was capable of doing but not allowed to. -
None of the sign companies I’ve worked for have qualified sparkies wiring out boxes or wiring them in on site.
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Nik, to be honest I am not surprised at all, I have seen some shocking installations (excuse the pun). Did they use to fit a plug or hardwire them? If they were hardwired were they added to an existing ring main or on a separate feed? If they are added to an existing ring main how did they know they would not be overloading the system and if they were on a separate feed they shouldn’t have been anywhere near a fuse box in the first place.
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Sparkies usually leave a fused spare for us to wire into. It’s easy enough to wire in. I have an electrical background so I’m used to it.
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Nik, yes I know it is not difficult and I don’t doubt that you are capable but you are still not allowed to do it under current wiring regulations.
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