Pro’s and Cons of FlexFace signs !

[Russell Spencer]

great for large stuff without joins and for re-producing full colour graphics to illuminate. Especially good for long signs (20-30m)
Must be out of harms way though as they are quite prone to slashing from our beautiful youth of today.

[Robert Lambie]

what size of sign is it you intend using it on?
do you yet have a supplier for it?
where will it be fitted and will it be high?

[Dave Harrison]

Thanks for the replies guys. There are two signs 6m x 3m to be installed subject to a pending planning application. They are both to be installed round about first floor level on the side of a warehouse about 20ft up. I have been quoted from universal, and it seemed quite reasonable considering the size, then they put me in touch with someone to print the skins.
I’ve started to notice people using these on smaller shop fascias in and around London with some cracking results so I’m looking forward to fitting my first one. Just not looking forward to going up in the cherry picker haven’t been in one for a while 😥

PS I take it the smaller skins can be printed on your average versa JV3 cadet ?
What sort of lifespan are to be expected of the skins either lacquered or unlacquered ?

[Robert Lambie]

i have two flexface signs to fit the exact same size of that in about 2 weeks time.
mine are up around 30ft and will be fitted from a cherry picker.
if you can get a rough torrain scissor lift with a platform of around 15ft it will make your job so much easier. bucket cherry pickers work fine but your very restricted and takes longer to fit.
using scaffold to fit signs this size with large skins is crap in my opinion…
takes ages and is very actually more dangerous.

ive been using signbase uk, not the cheapest i may add but they do have a great system that is easy to use. they will provide the lot if need be, i.e any sort of box, skins… with or without prints, illuminated, non-illuminated etc etc
i will call universal regarding theirs… i did speak to them about 12 months ago when they started selling their system but… (no disrespect) the guy dealing with my order didnt give me any enthusiasm in using them. his knowledge of the flexface systems was very limited and everything i asked him, he said, ill call you back on that. in their defence, they had just started offering the system, so like i said, ill give them another go… maybe even call them tomorrow.
Universal was a fair bit cheaper than signbase uk…

how many guys will be fitting your sign mate?

[Dave Harrison]

I have priced the job for a 3 man team, me plus two subcontractors one of whom is an NIC registered sparks.
I was indeed thinking about using a scissor lift as the access around the building is very good, its all level ground, and will give a larger platform to work from. The only thing is I’m not sure my IPAF cert covers them I only did my training on towable (nifty’s) and Pod and boom. So I might have to quickly book up an add on course.

We are planning to install the boxes in 3 (2m x 3m) sections. I believe they come with a joining extrusion which allows for perfect alignment. ( I hope )

It has been suggested that with enough fixings I can mount the boxes directly onto the metal cladding of the building and this will be sufficient. I have reservations about this and would like to somehow mount through the cladding onto the steel structure of the warehouse. What are you’re thoughts on fitting these Robert ?

Dave

[Robert Lambie]

i thought the same mate… i.e. hit the steel frame with some fixings for added support.
i used wood tech screws 4 inch long and steel tech screws 6 inch long, so i could catch the frame at the back… reality is. once the wood techs are in place you "wont" need the steel ones fixing onto the framework. the wood techs "into the metal cladding" are "solid" trust me on that… you do need a 4 or 5mm drill bit to create a pilot hole in the cladding then you screw in your wood tech. the wood techs thread is about 7mm so its a lovely tight fit, making it very secure.
you do have to drill through your flexface framework into the building of course… "not just the thin backing panel"

yes, these things do normaly come with decent joining brackets for easy alignment.

[John Childs]

Dave,

I hate signs and fought tooth and nail not to get the job, but the customer (a mate)insisted, so I put up a 9 x 2 metre flex face last weekend. It came from Kestrel Signs in Birmingham.

It turned out to be simplicity itself. Email Kestrel the artwork, give them the customer’s address for delivery, then sit back and wait for it all to happen. Everything we needed was included in the kit, it was all labelled and fitted together a treat first time. We just bowled up with a couple of battery drills and a pocket full of self tappers and away we went.

However, I think you are right to be concerned about security. I am sure that with enough fixings the sign would stick to the cladding no problem, but I could see it pulling the cladding off the building.

Screwfix Direct do some long self drilling, self tapping thingies which would have been ideal for getting though the sign support channels, cladding, insulation and into a nice solid steel channel forming part of the building structure. That would have allowed one sided fixings with no need to get up inside the building but unfortunately at 85mm they were not quite long enough. What I had to do was to get some long bolts and nuts from the local hardware store and use those instead. It wasn’t difficult but it did add a bit of extra time to the job, and at least I can sleep at night now.

[Guy Burt-Davies]

We produce quite a lot of Flexface boxes and have always found the Insight system to be one of the easiest to use and cheapest to buy – they’ve just undercut Universal by 15% on 3 5m x 3m boxes.

Robert, I’m surprised at your comments about Universal as their system is one of the original ones & has been available for several years at least so can’t understand why they made such a song & dance about quoting you.

[Ben Innes]

Tech screws have a cutting bit on the tip. Put the screw into your bit holder and wind it into the steel. Like you are drilling a hole and putting the screw in at the same time. No need for pilot drilling!

[Robert Lambie]

quote Binnes:

Tech screws have a cutting bit on the tip. Put the screw into your bit holder and wind it into the steel. Like you are drilling a hole and putting the screw in at the same time. No need for pilot drilling!

There are various types of tech screws… the ones i am referring to are "wood techs" that are being used on metal cladding.
Wood techs do not have the self drilling-to-taping heads. they have basically got a point that you would get with a regular wood screw, so a pilot hole must be drilled prior to screw into the metal.

[Robert Lambie]

quote Guy Burt-Davies:

Robert, I’m surprised at your comments about Universal as their system is one of the original ones & has been available for several years at least so can’t understand why they made such a song & dance about quoting you.

I was confused myself Guy…
I had used flexface signs in the past but an existing customer of ours required much bigger signs than we had been supplying them till now.
flexface was the obvious answer, but the problem was…
"I needed to mount a large flat-cut dibond logo on the face using Locators/standoffs. to do this, as you will probably know, you need a risen section within the box to come up flush behind the skin to fix onto"
this section was pretty large and i had to be sure everything was spot on, as this job would be on going.
anyway, when speaking to the guy on the phone he assured me well enough they did flexface sign systems, but as soon as i started asking about risen sections and how the tensioning system worked he didnt inspire confidence in me. he also mention this is a new system to them and thats why he would call me back. i am unsure whether he meant the actual felxface system or just the extras i was asking about… but he did say he would call me back, and did so… when i called signbase they guy instantly knew what i was talking about and reassured me on various things… giving me examples of work they did themselves mounting neon onto the face of flexface signs. so signbase it was because i was really pressed for time. i had about 2 weeks to get the sign fabricated and installed in england.

come to think on it, it could simply have been a new start employee at universal…. 😕

as i said, i have another two to fit in a couple of weeks and i will be videoing the install also so you will see first hand the system i am using.

"insight" :lol1: you know i never even gave them a thought and they are only a few miles from me 😳 bloody typical…. i bet i could have got these two i am doing now faster from them, if not cheaper.

i spoke to Kestral today after john mentioned them… they are quoting me on some and getting back to me. ill have to give insight a call too… as well as giving universal another go.