printing logos and brand names… advice

[David-Foster-]

I would expect Manchester United to want a cut, even if they had given you permission to use it which I doubt they will as they have their own merchandisers. It’s their logo and they own the copyright. Same with everything else that you didn’t draw yourself.

Someone else may but more flesh on the bones of my statement.

[Barbara Eden]

Hello Paul
Can’t answer some of your questions-I’m sure you’ll find them in the search file though.
But as regards brand names on football shirts etc-it’s a no no.
Companies pay large sums of money for a license to do them-which is probably why they cost so much!!

Selling them online would really be dicey, companies are starting to clamp down on copyright-and who can blame them really 😕

Barbara

[PaoloGray]

Yeah, I thought I’d run into this problem!

Oh, well. Time to give the football teams a call and offer to sell the product through their programs and webshites!

Paul

[Steve Underhill]

You would be very lucky to have something to sell them that they dont do already, their club shops already sell most printed things, and gifts etc.
Try it though you never know, but as for using their logo’s
you will be jumped on immediately you sell anything with them on.
Even the sites you used to be able to get football crests on have had all the premiership logos taken down.

[Lee Ballard]

You’ll find the same issues with vehicle manufacturers too. Some from what I know are worse then others. Ford, Jaguar, Land Rover, Renault, BMW to name a few are ones I know at least one person whom has had a ‘letter’ from them. One person I know ended up loosing a fair amount of money in settlement to one.

[Steve Underhill]

I think normally they will send out a cease and desist order forst, if it then continues they issue court proceedings.
Thats how I have heard of it working in the T shirt printing industry anyway, Design your own and be original thats what I do, that way the only cease and desist orders I ever se will be ones I send out. 😛

[Russell Huffer]

Companys will protect there logos and you can be sure they will take action against any person they see using there logo without there consent.

One of my clients sponsers Manchester United and even they are only allowed to use the logo on certain areas of there exhibition stand.

Regards

Russell.

[Simon.James]

Hi Paul

you can get almost any logo from brands of the world. i dont think you can officially sell anything with an official logo on, we do regular work for Swansea City, The Ospreys and have had 1 or 2 jobs from the devils, but there isnt a lot of money in it, as Sports clubs get so much sponsorship from companies, rather than the other way around, I actually sponsor the osprey and have a 15ft x 3 ft TV Board this season behind the goal down at the liberty stadium

I do a lot of work with a local caricature artist, who helped design Super ted and we have printed a lot of sporting banners and approached many football clubs including Man utd. and they wanted us to give them tens of thousands of pounds in corporate sponsorship to legally use their logo and they also wanted to sell our goods in there shops and brochures with a large mark up. it was a dead loss. You may have seen the 2005 special edition grand slam posters we done for the six nations in some of the Cafe,s in canton.

I lost a fortune trying to get Football clubs on board we set up a company called paperchain Publicity limited drawing football and rugby players with logo,s on which failed after about a year. We did however get a nice little job of a chap called Sir Richard Branson who commissioned us personally to produce a 40ft x 5ft banner to go around his living room for a sixties party he was holding, just to prove I am not bulling you, if you are ever around my way i will show you the proofs and the photo,s we took.
even that job I managed to loose at least a £100 on!.

going back to logo,s I know a clothing guy in Cardiff who prints and silk screens loads of t-shirts etc. does really well he did have a warning last year from a firm of solicitors working on behalf of Warner Bros, because what he was selling on ebay (bart simpson and lots of bands stuff). but nothing at all come of it. in conclusion there are loads of people doing it maybe up to 3/4s of ebay traders without any comebacks but i wouldnt open a shop on the high street selling your clobber !

we will have to meet up one day, i am always in Chapter Arts centre if you ever get in there!

kind regards

simon cardiff

[Steve Underhill]

Theres also 2 other reasons, plagiarism, and dignity.
Be original, simple as that.

[Simon.James]

Hi Steve

its funny we have got on to this subject as today , I have been asked to design a shop window for a guy who plans to sell Retro and Mod Clothing, I have recreated a logo of a famous Mod Club from the sixties (now closed) and reveresed the lettering to hopefully avoid any copyright issues. He also wants a big target in the window and loads of brand names on the window. ie. Ben Sherman, Lambretta, Fred Perry, so what would your stand be on this, wouldnt you class it has advertising or would you leave it alone.

whats the crack, if you are instructed and paid to do something who is breaking any copyright laws you or the customer!

Simon

[Steve Underhill]

Its a dodgy area, luckily I dont get asked to do many jobs except the odd football logo or a cartoon character, in the summer from tourists.
I tell them about the copyright issue and they generally have something else.

To put peoples brands and logos on a shop window you may find that if you approach the individual companies and inform them he is stocking their brands they will send him pos material and decals to display anyway.
If not they may give permission to use their logo but with some pretty big restrictions on placement etc.
Theres more knowledgable people here than me on the subject so Ill let them carry on from here.
Copyright and trademark use is a minefield.

They wouldnt let me call my sign shop, AOL21st centuryfoxintel signs.
Wierd :lol1:

Heres an interesting article taken from a website on copyright law.

Typical duration of legal copyright protection:
Normal protection provided by the Berne Convention is life of the author plus fifty years from death, with the following exceptions:

Film, cinematographic work:
50 years from the making of the work, or if made available to the public within the 50 years, (i.e. by publication or performance), 50 years from the date the author first makes the work available to the public.

Anonymous works:
50 years from the date made available to the public.

Artistic works, such as photographs and applied art:
At least 25 years from creation.

Duration will always run from January 1st of the year following the event indicated.

In all cases, individual national laws can, and often will, allow additional protection over and above the terms of the Convention. For example, in the UK most work is protected for the life of the author plus 70 years. The Convention sets out what authors can realistically expect. There are also exceptions allowed for countries bound by the Rome Act.

What happens when copyright expires?
When the term of copyright protection has expired, the work falls into the public domain. This means that the work, has effectively become public property and may be used freely.

It should be stressed that actual duration will vary under national laws, and you should check the laws of individual countries before you attempt to use a work.

So all is well for me to use the last supper for my amusing easter T shirt it would seem :lol1:

[Simon.James]

Hi Steve

There a kebab shop down here in the valleys called McDoners, Mc donalds were on the front page of our local paper saying that there legal eagles would close him down unless he changed his name. some 8 years later he is still there and still called Mcdoners.

Simon

[Steve Underhill]

Does he have a big yellow M outside his place though?
They cant stop people putting a Mc in front of a food outlet surely?
They can threaten legal action but I imagine a court would throw it out.
Its just corporate bullying.

[PaoloGray]

Simon, I go to Chapter sometimes with the bird.
Will have to exchange numbers and have a beer.

Give me a call on 07834 981622

Thanks

Paul

[Paul Wilson]

I was just running a search on info for this kind of thing. How different does a logo have to be before it stops infringing copyright. I.e. there’s a motorcycle based discussion board who want some t-shirts and other garments making. Say it’s "FireBlade.org" their website has the official honda fireblade logo with ".org" scrawled on to create a complete logo. The blade forums now want this logo putting a t-shirt but someone highlighted honda has recently gone after companies selling their artwork in various forms without any permission. Would it be possible to tweak and modify to the logo (substituting fonts for similar fonts and warping certain elements of the blade logo) so it looks similar but is actually different to the original?

[Graeme Speirs]

i used to work very closely with glasgow rangers in my previous job and they had their own ex policeman looking out for pirate/fake merchandise etc, most clubs/buisiness’s/brands will take a very hard line on this sort of thing, probably ok for doing one offs for mates etc but I wouldnt be wanting to punt it elsewhere.

cheers
graeme