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Print & Cut Alignment on HP Latex Printer & Summa Cutter
Hi All,
I’ve got what appears to be an ongoing issue when printing and cutting smaller rounded decals.. eg, I’ve just done a sheet of VW badges at 56mm, 2mm bleed with a cut line 2mm in, 4 rows of 19No 55mm round stickers, and to fill some space a load of my own oval stickers which are domed and go on vehicles..The problem is that the outside edges cut fine but as the cutter works it’s way inwards and up the sheet, it cuts further and further out. this only happens on small round decals and can be as much as 4mm out in the centre and by the time it gets to the 4th row.. it’s almost as if the material has somehow stretched in the centre of the print and along it’s vertical length, could this be heat or such?
I have just cut a load of rectangular decals on a different hi-tack media with no such issues. All other prints I usually do will contour cut perfectly too, just seems to be small circles that it doesn’t like. I know it’s not the file!
I will cut a batch now from a higher spec media to see if it works but, this can’t be a permanent fix as I’m not printing throw-away stickers on top end avery print film!
Any HP users found this ussue and cured it?
thanks,
Hugh -
13 Replies
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We’ve had a very similar issue with our HP26500 and summa D140.
Couple of things we did were to set panelling on and set the panel markers a LOT closer together (think we set them down to around 200mm). Sorry if I’m telling you how to suck eggs here, but it will treat the job in small panels, doing all the kiss and flex cuts within the set vertical panel length (200mm in this case), then move on to the next panel, realigning itself as it goes. Helped quite a bit.
Other thing is to play around with the profile setting on the printer, reducing the heat as much as possible, as the excessive heat given off by the 26500 does seem to warp low-end vinyls (we use a lot of low end stuff!).
Also, we were using a basic monomeric vinyl for basic sticker stuff. But we found just swapping for a basic polymeric (usually not much in the price when you work out the square metre cost) did help quite a lot as it seems to tolerate the heat quite a bit more and doesn’t seem to warp as much.
There is another workaround but it takes a bit of setting up as it’s using all the barcode servers but basically enables you to print lots of little jobs, all at the same time. Then put them in the Summa and it will cut each job one by one, automatically moving on to the next one when it’s done, and completely resetting it’s alignment as it goes.
Try the other stuff for now though! I’ll help as much as I can!
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We’ve had this issue to with monomeric materials. I just use LG polymeric for everything now which solves the problem. I do intend to look at a cheaper material again sometime and play around with heat settings but haven’t had time as of yet!
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We had similar problems, vertically from new. Smaller runs helped,
Gradually over the years we started to have issues with the summa, missing text altogether etc.
After 8 years of use Long runs of text became unpredictable so we bought another suma. New.
Tried to contour cut on day one and it was perfect, like you we did wheel centres, they had a printed boarder 2mm from the edge so any miss stuck out, but since buying new it’s been perfect.
Not much help but it could be a problem with one of the axis -
I dont use Latex ink but when I set up cut server with my Summa I can remember reading in the documentation about setting up registration for print specifically from latex printers. In some instances the media bows in the middle due to the heat when curing. I think you need to set up XY registration from what I can remember and also on longer print jobs sending panels through in a different way. Cant remember the specifics but its all there in Summa Cut documentation.
Hope that helps.
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quote Peter Wynne:We’ve had a very similar issue with our HP26500 and summa D140.Couple of things we did were to set panelling on and set the panel markers a LOT closer together (think we set them down to around 200mm). Sorry if I’m telling you how to suck eggs here, but it will treat the job in small panels, doing all the kiss and flex cuts within the set vertical panel length (200mm in this case), then move on to the next panel, realigning itself as it goes. Helped quite a bit.
Other thing is to play around with the profile setting on the printer, reducing the heat as much as possible, as the excessive heat given off by the 26500 does seem to warp low-end vinyls (we use a lot of low end stuff!).
Also, we were using a basic monomeric vinyl for basic sticker stuff. But we found just swapping for a basic polymeric (usually not much in the price when you work out the square metre cost) did help quite a lot as it seems to tolerate the heat quite a bit more and doesn’t seem to warp as much.
There is another workaround but it takes a bit of setting up as it’s using all the barcode servers but basically enables you to print lots of little jobs, all at the same time. Then put them in the Summa and it will cut each job one by one, automatically moving on to the next one when it’s done, and completely resetting it’s alignment as it goes.
Try the other stuff for now though! I’ll help as much as I can!
Thanks Peter (and everyone),
I use the same set-up as you, although until I get onyx talking to my summa D140r I am running the cut file from winplot on another pc!
The cheap film is image perfect 2528 gloss white permanent clear adhesive.. looks like this will be relegated to builders boards and such!
I ran the same file on every dennison MP2804 (not cheap!) and it did exaclty the same thing, I’m still running most things on the standard HP gloss profile at present – maybe it’s time to learn about the profiles! When I did use the avery profile I didn’t like the results though :-/
it’s got to be the material deforming, I wonder if a longer blank lead in will help.. large prints seem to contour cut perfectly.
Lorraine – it’s a brand new plotter, on everything but these small round decals it seems to be fine, I’ll see about lowering the heat for it and perhaps changing to a polymeric (if this is indeed a mono)
thanks all..
Hugh
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having run a straight edge along the bottom registration line, I can see that it bows inwards by up to 2mm in places along it’s length, this is with reduced heat from 105 to 92°c, will cut it for the sake of seeing how much better it is.
how low can I take the curing temp before it’s risking ink coming out wet?
thanks again
Hugh -
quote Hugh Potter:having run a straight edge along the bottom registration line, I can see that it bows inwards by up to 2mm in places along it’s length, this is with reduced heat from 105 to 92°c, will cut it for the sake of seeing how much better it is.
how low can I take the curing temp before it’s risking ink coming out wet?
thanks again
HughWhich is why you need to use Summa cut server, it has features which are specifically designed to deal with this scenario. The Opus eye measures the distortion along the width of the print job and compensates for it
I cant find the documentation which explains this, I’m sure Art Systems will be able to help.
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Here is the link which describes the issue;
ftp://ftp.onyxgfx.com/TechSupport/White … _Patch.pdf
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Thanks Steff,
that makes sense to compensate for the distortion… I’ll look into it more.
I’ve never heard of summa cut server – or is that the job editor within onyx? The patch is for onyx by the looks of it, so i’m inclined to think it’s the onyx cut server?
Sorry to sound dumb – onyx is all new to me!
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quote Hugh Potter:Thanks Steff,
that makes sense to compensate for the distortion… I’ll look into it more.
I’ve never heard of summa cut server – or is that the job editor within onyx? The patch is for onyx by the looks of it, so i’m inclined to think it’s the onyx cut server?
Sorry to sound dumb – onyx is all new to me!
Cut server is available for all OPUS eye Summa cutters as far as I am aware. We use cut server alongside Flexi, I am sure it works with other RIP’s too. Art systems will be able to advise you as they distribute both HP latex machines and Summa kit as well. Oh and also Onyx (which I presume you are running looking at your machine combination).
If you are using onyx RIP, cut server integrates into your workflow much better than with flexi and is extremely easy to use
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Hi
CutServer is actually part of the Onyx software package – Summa cutters come with some software called WinPlot.
You can use either but the Onyx Cutserver workflow is more efficient.
I have put a document together that explains the whole cutting workflow from Illustrator through Onyx to the Summa – hopefully it will be attached to this post.
Many thanks,
Andrew
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Don’t forget the straightness optimisation in advance settings for the material to get rid of the bend.
Mark
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quote Andrew Edwards:Hi
CutServer is actually part of the Onyx software package – Summa cutters come with some software called WinPlot.
You can use either but the Onyx Cutserver workflow is more efficient.
I have put a document together that explains the whole cutting workflow from Illustrator through Onyx to the Summa – hopefully it will be attached to this post.
Many thanks,
Andrew
Thank you Andrew,
I’ll have a proper read of that later and look to set it all up properly, currently cutting from winplot on another pc as the cutter hasn’t been found on the laptop running the printer / onyx.Mark, Thanks for the tip.
Hugh
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