Percentage of sales ??

[Richard Urquhart]

10-15% for me
Rich

[Peter Normington]

quote Shaun Cleary:

What percentage of your sales a year would you say banners hold.

Mine at the minute is around 75%.

Shaun
Can I ask what is the point of the question?
if you trade print banners then it could be 100%
if you just do vehicle graphics it could be 0%
or any figure in between

Peter

[John Childs]

A small fraction of one per cent.

Why? 😀

[Peter Normington]

quote Shaun Cleary:

What percentage of your sales a year would you say banners hold.

Mine at the minute is around 75%.

so if I do 3 banners a year, and one van, my percentage would be the same as yours.
Peter

[Phill Fenton]

For some reason – and I honestly don’t know why – I do very few banners. Percentage wise it’s probably less than 5% or so.

I think there is a perception amongst buyers that banners should be inexpensive. Perhaps the reason for my low banner sales volume is that I treat banners the same as every other sign I do and price these based on the time they take to make along with the materials cost. However, they are normally perceived as low cost, short term signs, and perhaps they should be priced as such to maximise sales.

[Shaun Cleary]

My question was based on wanting to find out if there where business out there surviving off selling banners – labels and graphics customers could apply themselves.

I have no problems making banners, labels or car graphics, I do have a problem with installing them or making shop signs (No experience).

I am concerned in that most sign shops I come across either on there website or on ads seem to be more installers than anything else.

On a side note: Is there any courses that are offered like wrap courses for install off signs on shops, windows and vans.

[Karl Williams]

So what experience have you got Shaun? Just seems to me like you’re after some market research. Go out on the streets where you live and look around and you’ll find your answer.

[John Childs]

Shaun,

I think it is perfectly possible to make a living doing supply only stuff. After all, there are people out there doing it already. The two things that spring to mind are that:-

1. You would be looking at a completely different market to most of us here, and would need to target your advertising and promotional efforts accordingly.

2. You would be excluding yourself from a lot of work, and would therefore find it a lot more difficult to succeed.

If you can’t do the practical side of the business, three ways out of that dilemma suggest themselves:-

1. Employ somebody that can.

2. Go and work for somebody else for a few years and learn the skills.

3. Buy a copy of Phill’s book.

[Shaun Cleary]

Buy a copy of Phill’s book – Already here on my desk C:.

I was just wondering if there where courses for the install of shop signs and vehicle graphics.

Some of you must have learned from other sources than working for someone ??

[Karl Williams]

quote Shaun Cleary:

Buy a copy of Phill’s book – Already here on my desk C:.

I was just wondering if there where courses for the install of shop signs and vehicle graphics.

Some of you must have learned from other sources than working for someone ??

No Shaun. Everyone I know in this trade are either self taught or time served in the trade. Not read Phills book. But if you think that will give you all the qualifications to run a business then you’re wrong. I’ve heard his book is very good and no doubt it is.
I should stick to the small stuff first and gradually work your way up.

[Shane Drew]

Shaun, I agree with Karl on this one. You can’t beat experience, and you only get that by putting in the hard yards, making mistakes and trying to fix them.

I’m sure Phills book is 1st class, but you can’t buy the experience, or learn it in a book. If you could, we’d all be experts and this forum would be worthless.

Supply only is a market I sell to here. You work with tighter margins and have to know the products you are using and how they react to certain conditions.

I only do 2 or 3% of my income as banners. But not all material is the same so some material prints better than others. Knowing which ones works for you is part of the learning curve. It is the same with print materials.

What works for me may not work for you.

[Shaun Cleary]

I do a lot of business on trade at the minute (Banners – labels), I will just have to try and learn myself.

With Roland offering a wrap course I thought they might of offered other courses on application.

[Martin Pearson]

Some colleges run general signmaking courses still I believe, most of these were aimed more at the Traditional Signmaker but did cover some vinyl work. Not sure if they are still run or where so you might try contacting your local colleges.
I doubt that much if any will cover what you are looking for though.

The BSGA also do some training through colleges but I am not sure what is covered in the qualifications. Might find some info of use here.

http://www.bsga.co.uk/activ_educate.php

There are also Company’s that will do installation only and will work for a number of different sign company’s. They use an unmarked van so the customer is not aware that they are not your fitters. You could always have a look around for one of these company’s in your area and see how they work and what theycharge. Will obviously cut into your profit but might be better for you to just concentrate on manufacture for now rather than trying to learn everything at once.
Or you could find a local Joiner who would be prepared to work doing installs for you.

If you are looking at taking on work other than just supply then start by taking on small jobs that aren’t to involved and work your way up as your experience grows.

[Colin Bland]

Hi Shaun

Very easy in this business to get out of your depth very quickly – I have been doing this for 30 years at all levels in the business and still learn something every time i walk down a high street not all of it good !!

Looking at some of your previous posts it is apparent that you have a lot to learn. I would suggest that you keep clear of fascia sign installation until you have more confidence and more importantly the equipment to carry out the installation safely.

I would suggest employing sub contract fitters and then going on site to "supervise" the installation – if they are good you will learn loads.

Colin

[Jason Xuereb]

Shaun,

I’ve been in this business for about three years. It takes time you make mistakes. Just make sure your doing smaller jobs and accept that on some jobs your going to loose money.

You can do banner installs but you need certain things. I know here in Australia if your operating access equipment you need the proper training. Most banner installs are done in the air around here any ways.

You also need the proper power tools and sometimes a helping hand.

I know I was never shown how to do my first kedar banner install but I asked on these boards and just started with a fairly small banner.

As to applying vinyl to shop fronts etc its the same thing. Practice, practice, practice.

I remember my first job I forgot to remove the protective sheeting off the substrate and applied my vinyl over the top. What a nightmare. You make mistakes then you learn a lesson and hopefully never repeat the mistake.

[Shane Drew]

quote Jason Xuereb:

I remember my first job I forgot to remove the protective sheeting off the substrate and applied my vinyl over the top. What a nightmare.

:lol1: me too 😳 glad I’m not the only one then 😕

[Jason Xuereb]

lol yeh as I removed the app I remember seeing all these bubbles thinking god oh why I squeegeed down that vinyl so hard.

[Lorraine Clinch]

quote Shane Drew:

quote Jason Xuereb:

I remember my first job I forgot to remove the protective sheeting off the substrate and applied my vinyl over the top. What a nightmare.

:lol1: me too 😳 glad I’m not the only one then 😕

:lol1: I should imagine we have all done something we later shudder over-it’s OK as long as it’s not in front of the customer 😮

Shaun, you really should concentrate on learning the trade as well as you can, and, if you are not a ‘manual’ type of person with a good practical turn, factor the installation cost as an extra on your costs. You will often find, that for normal jobs (shop fascias, etc) that the customer will fit themselves, rather than pay the installation fee on top. Bit of a get-out clause, or maybe that’s cause they can’t see me 10ft up a ladder!

[John Childs]

quote Lorraine Clinch:

:lol1: I should imagine we have all done something we later shudder over

I wasn’t going to mention it Lorraine, but seeing as you brought it up……..

Clear app tape. 😀

And no, I’m not immune to doing silly things either. Like ordering an aluminium framed perspex sign that was so long that the extreme of expansion and contraction was six inches. Unfortunately there was only two inches of frame at each end for a total of four. 😳

Fortunately, when the sign arrived, and we laid it out on the ground and could see the enormity of it, it dawned on me that there might be a problem. I called the manufacturer and asked if they’d done anything that large before, and they told me that they had once done one slightly longer. I asked if that earlier sign was alright and their words were, "Oh no. The panels blew out".

I went for Plan B and, although we have cut some up to make smaller signs, the majority of that highly expensive frame and panels still sit in a corner of our workshop, fifteen years later, as a constant reminder to think before I act. 😀

[Phill Fenton]

quote John Childs:

quote Lorraine Clinch:

:lol1: I should imagine we have all done something we later shudder over

I wasn’t going to mention it Lorraine, but seeing as you brought it up……..

Clear app tape. 😀

Well you have mentioned it now – so tell us the full story then :lol1:

[John Childs]

quote Phill:

Well you have mentioned it now – so tell us the full story then :lol1:

Good manners dictate that I should leave that to Lorraine. 😀

[Phill Fenton]

Let me guess – she left the clear application tape on the decal after applying :lol1: