Panatrim Frames – ready made or make you own?

[John Childs]

I won’t use Panatrim at all. I hate the damned stuff.

On the rare occasions I get involved in signs I use the nice three piece extrusion frames from Kestrel with the panels already cut and fitted. All I have to do is whack on the vinyl and job done.

[Robert Lambie]

im with john on this, i “used” to hate panatrim signs. so much hassle getting all to line up/square on site “if” you didnt have a good surface to work on.
knowing fine well i have to use this daily i come up with my own method of constructing a fail safe frame using the same trim. it may take about 15 min longer in the workshop to make it up, but i gaurantee it cuts the job down to about a quarter of the fitting time, “and” makes sure the sign fits snug as a bug… 😉

damn, just tried to give a link to the demo on this but im still on old server at work here and its not yet kicked in. 👿
browse the home page news and look for “better panatrim frames” demo…

[David McDonald]

Thanks Robert, I’d better upgrade my membership so I can access the demo’s.

Interested to know if there are any other suppliers beyond Universal and Kestrel who do the ready made frames?

Cheers
Macky D

[Robert Lambie]

ready made frames are good if you do not have the space. problem is.. if for some reason a size is out??? 😕
also, ready made means your handed 4 lengths of trim cut to size/mitred as far as i know… you still have the task of fitting. take a roughcast wall.. getting mitres to line up perfect can be a pain. as can various other surfaces.
all that said, i think more signs are fitted with panatrim than anything else.

just a thought, alutrade do them too im sure 😕

[Brian Little]

Johm do you have the number for Kestral

regards brian 😀 😀

[John Childs]

Kestrel Signs.
Tel: 0121 783 0779 or 0121 783 0792
Free Fax line: 0500 825927

You need their “signframe” product.

[Paul Goodwin]

Cherwell make ready made frames with boards too.

I use them quite a lot now

they use proframe 3000 as standard plus they have pqanatrim and eurotrim

01280 840297 ask for Jake

[Brian Little]

Thanks John & mort

[David McDonald]

Thanks for the info

[Stephen Ingham]

hi chaps, for those of you who do manufacture their own pantrim frames, how do you mitre the joints? do you use a powered mitre cutter or do it by hand.

if you use a powered mitre cutter can anyone recommend a tool to do the job easily and safely, as aluminium is dodgey to cut with a circular cutting mitre saw.

cheers
stephen

[Peter Normington]

I use a de walt mitre chopsaw. With an alli blade, Dont no the tooth pitch off hand, but its also fine for wood. Always make sure that the extrusion is clamped securely, and the blade is lubricated with wax. Cuts through ali like butter and get accurate mitres.
Peter

[Robert Lambie]

im with peter on this… i use a dewalt chop/mitre saw too.

i would advise to buy the best of the range, dont scrimp on this machine as it has bags of uses as opposed to just panatrim cuts.
(make sure you always use safety clamps) not shown in picture, but essentail for use with these types of machines.
get an alluminium blade with it. again try and get a good make as the crap makes go blunt fast.
wood and metal can easily be cut with these machines but wood tends to blunt a metal blade faster.

blade for cutting wood is like this :

blade for cutting metal is like this:

[Stephen Ingham]

robert, do you know the number of teeth on the disc? we have a similar cutter but only currently use it for cutting wood etc.

cheers
stephen

[Robert Lambie]

to be honest mate i am not sure.
if you have the small close teeth then its a metal cutting, if the larger teeth further appart as shown, its for wood.
thats about as much light as i can shed on this, but like said, always make sure you wax-up the blade. 😉

[Stephen Ingham]

nice one, cheers

i’ll sort it next week, cos we ave some frames to make next week

cheers
stephen

[Martin Pearson]

Robert careful what you say because its not true, plenty of wood cutting blades have small teeth which are close together and these should not be used to cut alli.
With wood large teeth that tend to be further apart are for cutting along the grain of the wood and smaller toothed blades are for cutting across the grain.

For cutting alli you need a blade with a negative rake, this is the angle that the teeth are set at. These blades tend to be a bit more expensive in fact if you buy a cheap mitre saw then the blade will cost more than the saw!!

Any good hardware store or engineering outlet will keep you straight.

[Robert Lambie]

quote Robert Lambie:

to be honest mate i am not sure.
if you have the small close teeth then its a metal cutting, if the larger teeth further appart as shown, its for wood.
thats about as much light as i can shed on this, but like said, always make sure you wax-up the blade. 😉

martin, you could be right mate… sorry. when i bought our chop saw many moons ago (not our newest one then of course) i bought it with metal and wood blades. the metal blade back then cost us about £80-£90.
when asking for advice from the guy (sales guy from glasgow saw center) he said basicaly what i said there. he went onto saying that the reason the small, closer tooth blade isnt recommended for wood is beacuse the wood shavings gets clogged between the small teeth and actually stops the blade.
this has happend many times with our guys and on occasion whne i “hear” it happening i pull them up for not only causeing themself danger, but blunting expensive blades.

im sure i am crossing wires with you on this, or newer blades have been brought about since then. (many moons ago now, sorry 😕 ).
thanks for bring this to our attention though mate.

[Martin Pearson]

No problem Robert and I am right on this one, don’t forget I’m an engineer by trade.
But I haven’t put this post up just to have a go at you, more because of something I should have mentioned in the previous post.
Before buying a saw find out what sizes & bores negative rake blades are available or you could find yourself buying a saw that is only suitable for cutting wood!!
Dewalt sell the blades for definate as that is what I use. Dewalt series 40 250mm x 30mm bore, with 5 degree negative rake.
If you already have a saw but cant find a blade with the same bore you might be able to get a bush to alter the bore of the blade. trent do a range of bushes for circular and mitre saws.

[Stephen Ingham]

martin, thanks for the valuable info, i’ll go to my local tool specialist tomorrow and get a disk for our saw.

stephen

[Gordon Forbes]

Just get a blade for cutting aluminium

[Paul Goodwin]

Thats what i have Forbie

when i bout my saw and bench ( one with extendable rollers to put long stuff on) i told them what i will be cutting with it and they threw one into the deal. saved me 60quid 🙂

just got to practice at getting good mitre joints now, i dont think i’m clamping right. 🙁

[Robert Lambie]

if your mitre saw clicks/locks properly into the 45 angle then the mitres should be true. however, sometimes our guys manage to mess it up?
the reason i have found is… when cutting a long length of trim. the side that is not in the chop saw is either slightly higher or lower than the flat of the chop saw. even though you have it “clamped” if it is lower than the flat, although a perfect 45 degree cut, the face of the join sits open, but neat/closed at the bottom, and vice versa if it is higher.

hope that makes sense 😕 😉

[Paul Goodwin]

Rob you described it so perfectly that i could even understand it after 6 pints of Guiness

honest 🙂

[Adrian Hewson]

Screwfix do a kerf balde which is equally good at cutting both dibond pastics and wood. http://www.screwfix.com/app/sfd/sea/sea … =1&x=0&y=0

However for full aluminium you need to go to a 60 tooth

[Stephen Ingham]

hiya chaps, took a trip to my local tool specialist and asked about the cutting disc for our mitre saw to cut pantrim.

got one with 80 teeth cuts like a hot knife through butter with excellent results instantly

how did we manage??

cheers
stephen

[Martin Pearson]

How are you clamping it Mort? If you have the clamp on top of the framing what sometimes happens is the top where it is clamped bends slightly, this means you dont get a true 45 degree cut. A small block of wood which fits neatly inside the frame will cure this and give you perfect 45 degree cuts, also make sure the blade is set up right as the saws don’t always come set up correctly and as rob has said make sure the framing stays level.

[Paul Goodwin]

Yep i think thats the problem Martin, when i get time i’m going to check it all out and make sure of my angle with me engineers square. i didn’t think about a block of wood.

Thanks

Paul