my vinyl is very brittle, why is this?

[Kevin Flowers]

Hi
i have actually raised this point with my rep & i am waiting for Oracal’s response will post when i get some info.

Kev

[Robert Lambie]

the bulk of our vinyls are oracal, we use allot every day of the week and i honestly have not heard anyone complain about it being brittle.
when i read your post i thought, "cold workshop" but you have binned that thought with your reply… even though, although our vinyl rooms are kept at a decent temp all the time, ide hardly say they were warm over the past week or so.
maybe a bad batch… maybe warehouse temps have got to the vinyl, who knows… one thing for sure, it is a very good vinyl.

i hope you and kev get the problem sorted soon…

[Kevin Flowers]

Hi
the rep from London Depot has actually taken samples away and was pulling it apart like paper, i noticed ii in the fact when it was weeded it would just come off in strips instead of one piece. He has also taken away sample of 551 has i have had some of this doing the same. When the rep visited i had been sent an A4 sample of JAC & used this as comparison which stretched when pulled the oracle just snapped.

Kev

[LeeMorris]

I noticed this with 751
Its really tricky to weed and does seem to rip a lot

Lee

[Nicola McIntosh]

quote leemorris:

I noticed this with 751
Its really tricky to weed and does seem to rip a lot
Lee

never had 751 rip with me, but you will find if your workshop is at a constant good temp it shouldnt…but 651 does all the time specially the gold 😀 just read robs post…thats what i get for speed reading 😕

nik

[Lynn Normington]

sorry to disagree Nik when weeding oracal 751 it doe’s rip but it isn’t a problem , but I have never had it go brittle and I have always found it easy to weed if cut right.

Lynn

[Kevin Flowers]

Lynn
brittle as a description may be wrong but the fact that it rips rather than having a bit of elasticity like most vinyls can cause problems when working with it. Even our rep agreed that there seemed to be a problem. The problem with weeding it isn’t a cutter error it is that the vinyl just tears as you try to weed so you end up weeding in strips instead of one piece.

Kev

[Nicola McIntosh]

quote Lynn:

sorry to disagree Nik when weeding oracal 751 it doe’s rip but it isn’t a problem

no your alright lynn, but i honestly have not had 751 rip when i weed, it weeds brillaint for me….very smooth and silky 😮 ….and im not slow at doing weeding either…i work like a tornado 😮 but i must admit, the only time i HAVE had 751 rip is when ive taken the application tape off too quick…but then thats me being too quick and thinking im a smart ar$e 😉

nik

[Alan Wharton]

i use 751c on everything and find it really good but i have found similar probs to what you talk about but ive learned how to cure it now, when i 1st started using 751c i found it very thin compared to metamark i was using and do still use so had to reset the force/pressure on the cutter but have found that on say 751c white i may have to use force set at say 17 but when i switch to say silver same 751c that pressure of 17 does not cut it properly so i was getting same prob as you, what i do now is test cut every single time b4 cutting vinyl especially when changing from 1 colour to another and i do need to adjust the pressure on the blade from time to time even though im using the same vinyl, i have found if i always use the graphtec controller it seems to be ok at the same setting all the time but when i forget to use the controller and just send a job to the cutter this is when its at its worst, even today did a simple job 5 letters didnt use the graphtec controler and it would not weed just ripped, fired the controller up which has the force setting as the same as the cutter and it cut and weeded fine, i like things with a bit of character and that keep you on your toes 😉

[Marcella Ross]

Thats exactly why I don’t use Oracal vinyl unless I have to. I find it pretty poor for weeding. I kept thinking I was missing something because lots of folks say how good it is ………. but at least I’m not alone 😀

Metamark weeds a treat in comparison.
But Oracal does apply well ……….!

[Peter Normington]

any cast material is, by nature delicate, and the plotter needs to be set to cut it properly, Oracle does tear easily, it also sticks to itself like like shut to a blunkit, so weeding has to be done methodically,
I have never had a problem, (thats cos lynn does all the weeding)even the really fine metalic silver, I cut at the same force as all the other colours, which is usually a couple of settings lighter that say avery 700 calendered stuff.

Let us know the outcome from the rep Kevin

Peter

[Dave Bruce]

I use Oracal 751C every day, and yep it is more difficult to work with than the old 751, never have a problem weeding, but it does tear quite easily. I was speaking to another signshop yesterday who stopped using it altogether when Oracal changed to cast, said they had all sorts of problems.

Dave

[Phill Fenton]

Yes I have found that since 751 series changed to a cast vinyl it is much more brittle than before. It varies with temperature too. In a cold workshop it is even more brittle. Even colours play a part – some colours being more brittle than others.

Personaly I prefered the older calandered 751 series vinyl to the cast version. I’ve even considered switching to 651 which is much cheaper but does not have the same longevity or so they say.

[Peter Normington]

You need to compare oracle with other cast material, not 651.or the old 751, I think the problem may be that oracle upgraded, and a lot of users had never used cast before, so were not familiar with the differences.
Oracle 751, is a good material. but is also comparatively cheap. you do get what you pay for, and my opinion, oracle is not the best, but certainly one of the best for value for money, that I have found.

Peter

[M Brown]

I’ve used cast material for over 20 years now. I’ve used many different manufactures cast vinyl, from 3M’s Scotchcal to KPMF’s cast. Cast vinyl is suppose to conformable, which means stretchy to be able to mold over rivets and deep recesses. If I pushed this material over a rivet or into to a recess if would break. Not what I call the performance of a cast material. Well not the batch that I bought any way.

The ripping of the material while weeding has got absolutely nothing to do with the pressure of the cutter.

There’s just something just not right about this vinyl batch that I have. I’ve bought 751c once before and I was very happy with it… but this time.. I think this batch of vinyl is very poor up against all of my other vinyls that I have.. and is stored in the exactly the same place and temperature.

I’m fitting this vinyl tomorrow and I hope it works well, as I don’t want my reputation tarnished by a bad batch of vinyl

[Chris Wool]

i have been using 751c since it came out only black & white thou and it always requires more care at both ends of the temp scale for weeding and fitting.
we have a heater above the weeding bench and this time of year just 2 mins on the bench and the weeding is transformed but had very little trouble after its fitted unlike some other vinyls.

having said that it you could have a extra bad batch i am just about to order a new roll fingers crossed

Chris