Car Dealership Job Quotation South West

[Iain Pearson]

Hi James, are you producing the graphics or just fitting ?
Do you have a visual or artwork so I can see what’s required. Bit difficult to price otherwise

[James Boden]

Hi Iian,

I’ll be producing and fitting them. This is the first, the others are along the same lines but for finance deals and probably only one colour.

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[Daniel Evans]

On the basis that this can be done in one go.

How does £140+vat sound?

Let us know how you get on.

[Iain Pearson]

If it’s straight off the roll cad vinyl, I’d be in around £75-£85 per vehicle mate

[Iain George]

quote Iain Pearson:

If it’s straight off the roll cad vinyl, I’d be in around £75-£85 per vehicle mate

Is that including install?

[Martin Pearson]

quote Iain George:

quote Iain Pearson:

If it’s straight off the roll cad vinyl, I’d be in around £75-£85 per vehicle mate

Is that including install?

I would guess Ian’s price is supplied & fitted & I bet the Dealership says it’s way to expensive 😆 😆

I was asked to do work for several dealerships over the years & they expect to pay peanuts, there is usually someone who will do it as well hoping to get more profitable work from it but they never do, well not to my knowledge anyway 😆

[Iain Pearson]

Yup that’s including install . Hour per vehicle @£35 per hour, rest on production/ materials

[James Boden]

quote Iain Pearson:

If it’s straight off the roll cad vinyl, I’d be in around £75-£85 per vehicle mate

Cheers Iain, this is around the figure I had in mind :thumbsup:

[Jon Marshall]

The upside is you can generally chuck this stuff on. We do dealership stuff quite often and there are always parts vans to do, maybe a van sales guy you can get in with, window graphics etc.

[Jean Oakley]

Id be charging £75-80 for this job fitted. I dont make much on it but as most garages are doing promotions every month its good bread and butter jobs. You also do get the odd parts van, banner and local signs do fit for sponsorship of local grounds. Always good to have a few garages on your customer list, they will always give your name out to other potential van drivers.

[David Hammond]

We’d be under £100 on this, unless it was the other side of town. They’re short term graphics, so cheaper vinyl can be used, but the it take the same amount of time regardless of material. OK if there’s no rush and you can do it in between other bits.

Not sure about others, but found dealers a bit slow to pay too 🙁

[Unknown Member]

Seems like it’s more hassle than it’s worth!

[Peter Wynne]

Jean and David, are you saying your prices would be for the whole job (4 vehicles)? Or per vehicle??

[Iain Pearson]

quote James Sahota:

Seems like it’s more hassle than it’s worth!

If it gets you repeat bread and butter work or the opportunity for additional areas then it is definitely worth it James.

I have built a successful business from doing those kind of "More hassle than it’s worth" jobs, just as many many other businesses on here

[David Hammond]

We’d be about £90 per vehicle, unless you can do them all in the 1 day, £75 per vehicle, £300 for a few hours cutting & weeding, few meters of vinyl, and half a day fitting?

Unless you have much profitable work why not it pays the bills, but they won’t always be like that.

[Phill Fenton]

I used to do a lot of this sort of thing for a Scottish dealer network – prices had to be keen but it was still well worth doing. Unfortunately they set up their own print department to service the dealerships so I was given the old heave ho :puppyeyes:

[Peter Wynne]

Ah that makes more sense David… thought £100 for all 4 seemed ridiculously cheap!!

Aye I’d probably be at £300 for all 4 supplied and fitted. Not bad for half a days work and a few metres of vinyl!

[Kevin Flowers]

Ensure you make the dealer aware you are not responsible for any fading on screens or paint marks upon removal etc. Had a Kia dealership have screen graphics only on short time but could always be seen when it rained or misted up when sold dealer wanted me to pay for a new screen. I pointed him to our quote & that we accepted no responsibility for fading caused by the vinyl making certain areas of glass or paintwork.

Kev

[Jean Oakley]

sorry didnt read there are four vehicles. Would be per vehicle but if i can do all at the same time under cover in their nice warm garage would be around £280-£300
forgot to add if they are giving you a bit of artistic liceince i find it very useful for geting shot of all my end of roll vinyl and vinyls ive had to get in for one off jobs :thumbsup:

[Emma batten]

I can’t believe people would quote under £100. I have a couple of dealers in in Portsmouth and i would not charge less than £100 a vehicle.

[Iain Pearson]

quote Emma batten:

I can’t believe people would quote under £100. I have a couple of dealers in in Portsmouth and i would not charge less than £100 a vehicle.

It’s "Horses for Courses" Emma.
There are so many "Bedroom warriors" with cheap Chinese vinyl cutters and even cheaper vinyl to contend with, pricing has to be realistic £75-£90 per vehicle is a fair price based on all the factors.
I am a quick installer, so would take less than an hour per vehicle, however if someone is not so quick it may take an hour or more per vehicle but take them less time to cut/weed/prepare the vinyl.
If you can get away with charging more, then that’s great, but many others can’t.

[Robert Lambie]

I think James Boden is closer to the correct price and frame of mind on the approach to this type of work.
He states the vehicles are just part of a larger job so he wants to be competitive, but does not want taken for a ride when it comes to future similar work.
Why? because he and the rest of us know fine well that is how car dealers work, "they are car salesmen" at the end of the day and continually screw into you until you are chasing your tail for nothing, then onto the next sign co.

You could ask yourself, "why are you being asked to quote for this and not the other companies already doing the work?"

the exact same story with estate agency signs. the promise of tons of orders that never come, but want to pay buttons as they dangle that carrot.

is there money to be made with the prospect of further work. maybe there is, but you must structure for it to make it work.
Some things to consider…
who supplies the artwork? normally YOU so its "rushed or looks crap".
next comes the materials. these need to be "bright" and cheap crap.
everything is last minute with car dealers and must be done yesterday.
then there is you fitting them in the rain, wind or snow as they are being kept out in the forecourts and they cant find the keys!
their location? are you driving a distance and how does that fair through traffic?
you get repeat work so now you have to strip the existing vinyl. its crap cheap stuff that is leaving glue, snapping and not good at coming off. you sold them it, your now responsible and you cant charge by the hour for removal if having issues.

at the end of the day i am NOT saying all are like this, but lets face it the customer is a "car salesman". 😆

even if there is money to be made, my own opinion is i would rather put my energy into work that pays well which you can build a reputation for doing more well paying jobs. the old busy fool scenario comes to mind.

as for pricing it. you could price the job as a whole and not give a breakdown. give a percentage discount based on spend. That way you have covered yourself should they expect the cars at the same price in future?

[Ian Johnston]

quote Phill Fenton:

I used to do a lot of this sort of thing for a Scottish dealer network – prices had to be keen but it was still well worth doing. Unfortunately they set up their own print department to service the dealerships so I was given the old heave ho

they probably bought your book Phil, and decided it was a easy :smiles:

There’s guys around here doing that sort of thing for £50-60. bedroom setups with no overheads at night, and they think they’re making a fortune :shocked:

[Iain George]

There’s guys around here doing that sort of thing for £50-60. bedroom setups with no overheads at night, and they think they’re making a fortune :shocked:

We have all got to start somewhere. I have always installed but people kept asking me to do there vans so I bought a little cheap Chinese cutter and started from home. I know have large workshop at the bottom of my garden with a Graphtec cutter work bench sublimation equipment and a steady income ,which is all declared ,to top up my wages.
I am looking to take the next step within the next 2 years and buy a printer and go completely self employed.

[Ruel Maxwell]

I’m not in the U.K. But I would charge the equivalent of £120 per vehicle based on the cost of vinyl here in Ja

[Ian Johnston]

quote Iain George:

There’s guys around here doing that sort of thing for £50-60. bedroom setups with no overheads at night, and they think they’re making a fortune :shocked:

We have all got to start somewhere. I have always installed but people kept asking me to do there vans so I bought a little cheap Chinese cutter and started from home. I know have large workshop at the bottom of my garden with a Graphtec cutter work bench sublimation equipment and a steady income ,which is all declared ,to top up my wages.
I am looking to take the next step within the next 2 years and buy a printer and go completely self employed.

Including business rates and planning permission for the shed ?! :bangshead:

[James Boden]

It’s been a good learning curb this one. Like Rob said I was looking at the bigger picture of all the other work they needed doing.

After the cars were completed I had to apply frosted graphic around the entire perimeter of the windows in the showroom and later this week I’m going back to apply large areas of printed vinyl.

It’s all last minute stuff and a bit of stress but it keeps the bank balance healthy and that’s the bottom line. I think maybe 6+ years ago you could get away with charging £100+ but I’m in an area of high competition and like Iain I’m a lot faster at applying graphics than I used to be. Get in – Bosh them on – Get out!

[Iain George]

The shed has its own electric supply and meter and I pay to run a business from home. So yes!
I am looking to get a proper unit or try and rent space in another unit.
Everything I have done is above board and declared to the relevant people but obviously this seems to make me some sort of back street trader to you Ian.

[David Hammond]

I don’t think Ian was directing his comment at everyone who works from home.

There’s nothing wrong with that, I’m fairly sure our own Hugh Potter started off working from home, and has built up a nice business. I’ve a customer who works from home, and is doing work for premier league football clubs.

On the other hand, I know others who work from home, and can afford to literally give it away. No tax to pay, no VAT, no overheads, but to be fair, I doubt they’ll ever make it viable to move from their home business.

At least twice a year we go through all our overheads and revise our hourly running costs, and provided we can cover the cost of the labour and make a profit, and there’s nothing better to do why not do these jobs. I wouldn’t be putting these before the larger, more profitable work though.

[Iain George]

Just to add I would have been looking at about £100 per vehicle for this job myself. I only use branded vinyl that I believe in. Mainly Metamark materials as they are down the road from me and I can collect. Being a worker from home does not always mean cheap prices. I have been undercut on jobs before by established, they have a shop or unit, companies because they can buy in materials in bulk at a cheaper price or even have some materials left over from other jobs that can used.

[Steff Davison]

Its horses for courses, working from home will mean you can never really scale.

To grow past a certain size you have to move into space, you have to have employees and all the over head that goes with it.

Its whatever works for you and the life style you have chosen, one isnt more or less "legitimate" than the other

I started from a 9ft x7ft bedroom, was I a "beer money" trader? everyone has to start somewhere.

[Iain George]

quote Steff Davison:

Its horses for courses, working from home will mean you can never really scale.

To grow past a certain size you have to move into space, you have to have employees and all the over head that goes with it.

Its whatever works for you and the life style you have chosen, one isnt more or less “legitimate” than the other

I started from a 9ft x7ft bedroom, was I a “beer money” trader? everyone has to start somewhere.

That is exactly what I am trying to say but it I felt that I was being told off and having my wrist slapped.

[David Hammond]

quote Steff Davison:

Its horses for courses, working from home will mean you can never really scale.

To grow past a certain size you have to move into space, you have to have employees and all the over head that goes with it.

Its whatever works for you and the life style you have chosen, one isnt more or less “legitimate” than the other

I started from a 9ft x7ft bedroom, was I a “beer money” trader? everyone has to start somewhere.

Which is the difference between ‘beer token’ set ups, who are happy to make a few £££ in the back pocket, whilst others like yourself, had an ambition, and I would assume charged accordingly to enable the expansion you’ve seen?

I read in a book many years ago, that low overheads are the companies benefit, not the customers :thumbsup:

[Iain George]

I must admit it started as beer tokens doing the odd van for a mate but as the word spread and was asked to start doing more shops and other bits it all changed. As I have said before I am still employed as we need the steady income at the moment but am looking at 2 years to go it alone fully

[Peter Wynne]

Totally agree with David’s comment above… low overheads means more money in your pocket, not the customers. But in the same context, if you have no unit to pay for, little or no equipment to maintain, no employee wages to pay, or any other overheads to account for, then you can price stuff up cheaper than other people… and why shouldn’t you! Obviously make sure your still making profit from it, but your low running costs are your positive.
If people/companies wan’t to "expand" and move into big units, with bigger/better equipment and more staff then great, good luck with it, but it simply means more overheads to pay.

I’m not saying anyone here is in this position, but what I have seen over the years are lots of people with "ambition" to grow and expand, and they do. They end up with big units and lots of staff working on bigger and bigger projects. But the reality is that they’re personally not making much more money, as all the extra profit in the big projects they’re doing is eaten up by everything else (wages, equipment, stock, tax, etc…)

Do whatever’s right for you 🙂

[Steff Davison]

quote David Hammond:

quote Steff Davison:

Its horses for courses, working from home will mean you can never really scale.

To grow past a certain size you have to move into space, you have to have employees and all the over head that goes with it.

Its whatever works for you and the life style you have chosen, one isnt more or less “legitimate” than the other

I started from a 9ft x7ft bedroom, was I a “beer money” trader? everyone has to start somewhere.

Which is the difference between ‘beer token’ set ups, who are happy to make a few £££ in the back pocket, whilst others like yourself, had an ambition, and I would assume charged accordingly to enable the expansion you’ve seen?

I read in a book many years ago, that low overheads are the companies benefit, not the customers :thumbsup:

I actually had to expand/move so that I was in a position to be able to work for less margin through increased turnover.
My market place is a really tough one (arent they all) and staying where I was I would have eventually been priced out by bigger more aggressive and efficient competitors.

My way of looking at lower percentage overheads is, everybody wins me and my customers. Although I am not a bespoke signmaker, I still believe the same principles apply. If you have lower costs why not use them to your advantage, keep some and pass some on. Just make sure you keep enough so that you can pay your increased costs when you do eventually need to move because you have run out of space.

Thats why I dont like the software pricing stuff, it builds too much cost into your product IMO. Profit margins dont mean "diddly" unless they are attached to a figure.

[Phill Fenton]

quote Steff Davison:

Its whatever works for you and the life style you have chosen, one isnt more or less “legitimate” than the other

I entirely agree.

[David Hammond]

Can’t disagree I’d probably be wealthier being employed, but I’m happy doing what I do.

[Steff Davison]

quote Peter Wynne:

I’m not saying anyone here is in this position, but what I have seen over the years are lots of people with “ambition” to grow and expand, and they do. They end up with big units and lots of staff working on bigger and bigger projects. But the reality is that they’re personally not making much more money, as all the extra profit in the big projects they’re doing is eaten up by everything else (wages, equipment, stock, tax, etc…)

Do whatever’s right for you 🙂

I am doing better now than when I started from my bedroom with next to zero expenses. But no one is "bomb proof" I could lose the lot in a fraction of the time it took me to build it. I try and stick to what I know, but take the odd small step into the unknown.

[Hugh Potter]

quote David Hammond:

I don’t think Ian was directing his comment at everyone who works from home.

There’s nothing wrong with that, I’m fairly sure our own Hugh Potter started off working from home, and has built up a nice business. .

I did indeed, will be 12yrs in october, though I spent 7 years working from my timber studio workshop (posh shed!) at the end of my garden.

I do think there’s a big difference between the ‘beer money’ signmakers and those with more serious intentions. some will always want beer money and be happy to work for little profit in spare time, others will have grander ideas and hopefully pursue them in a businesslike manner. When I first started there were two established signmakers in the area, one big firm and a small one man guy, oh, and also a trad brush guy.

Initially I bought a Summa cutter & coreldraw12 to satisfy my own drag racing needs – having been let down several times by a local firm, I would do stuff in small niche groups I was involved with and also the odd race car / support vehicles at the track, I guess at that point it was more beer money but from the moment I’d decided I was going self employed, I wanted to price competitively, not cheaply, I did my best to find out what others were charging, I even visited a couple of locals, introducing myself without being booted out the door! I did not want to be known as the cheap guy undercutting the established firms, I wanted to supply good work and set my prices in such a way that I was seen as a proper business – that was important to me.

The disadvantage of pricing like the bigger guys was obviously reputation, people didn’t know me and I guess I took so long to build as a result. The big advantage was that as and when my workflows increased and my equiment was upgraded, I didn’t have to suddenly hike my prices and scare people off, my margins dropped of course but, increased workflow and small price increases offset some of that in a satisfactory way.

I am still small fry really, no employees other than subbies / colleagues I have help me, but I have a good reputation, have finally got what I consider to be a good set-up and for the past three years have taken a regular income, I know I’ve still room for a lot of imporvement and might have to move again (reluctantly) in the near future, but I look at these things as an opportunity to better myself and the business.

As for the subject of the dealership cars, I generally avoid most jobs that go along the lines of "do us a good price on these and you’ll get all the other signwork", rarely does much good come from them, as soon as proper prices are applied to further work they’re onto the next signmaker!

I’d price around £80 each if all four could be done in one hit and it was local, a one off would attract a premium for travel time etc.