Aftermarket inks for Roland XC540 Pro

[Chris Wool]

if you are happy with what you get except price do not change.

[Unknown Member]

Chris

Price seems to be the only thing making me switch over……

Anybody recently got good deals on a full set of 440ml roland eco solvent inks or no anywhere I might get them.

Many Thanks

[Tom Davison]

Hi there,

Recently got a BOGOF offer from InkTec (you’ll have to search for your local supplier though) out of a magazine, they had a full page ad. We purchased a full set of 6 inks and got 6 free, and the ones we did pay for were half the price.

Many thanks.

[Lee Attewell]

Why wouldn’t you just go with the inks that are designed for the machine? These are expensive bits of kit, and I can’t see why you’d want to go and put something in it that may not work just to save a few bucks.

Why not just charge the end user (the client) the right price for the right gear and you’ve not missed out on anything have you?

don’t you guys in the UK have service agreements with your machines?

[John Childs]

Come on now……

What percentage of the price you charge for print relates to the cost of ink? I know that it can vary depending on coverage, but my guess would be somewhere between three and five per cent.

So, if you manage to cut your ink cost in half, that still only represents between one and a half to two and a half per cent of the sale price of your product.

To my mind the risks involved aren’t worth it.

[Bill McMurtry]

I think the risk is very much worth it. Genuine Mimaki ink for my 6 colour JV3 costs about $220 per 440ml cart. That works out at about $3000 for 6 Litres of genuine ink (1 Litre per colour). I currently pay less than $300 for the same amount of 3rd party ink. Over 2 years of faultless service has convinced me that this 3rd party ink is no more or less harmful to the printer than genuine ink and, perhaps most importantly, the end result is of an equally high quality.

[Shane Drew]

I agree with Bill. Both my SC540 are running techink, and I buy 1 litre of ink for the cost of a 440ml Roland cartridge.

The ability to fill on the fly is an advantage instead of running out of ink mid job, especially if the printer is running into the night while I sleep,

I also run orange and green instead of lc & lm, so it has many advantages.

And, my Techink is stronger and glossier in appearance, so I have that over my opposition too.

Only reason Roland don’t go bulk ink is because they are making huge margins on their ink sales in cartridge form.

I’ve been running Techink for 5 years and only been through 5 heads, so I think that speaks volumes too.
Techink are an oem manufacturer for other companies too, so they are well versed in the requirements for the modern printers.

[John Childs]

quote Bill McMurtry:

I think the risk is very much worth it.

That’s great Bill. So you’ve reduced your ink costs from five per cent of your print sale price to half a per cent. A four and a half per cent saving. That’s brilliant if it works for you.

My position is that…..

We read posts on here occasionally from people complaining that they have a problem with their printer and it has been out of service for a week or more, either because they don’t know how to fix it themselves, don’t know where to source the parts, or they’re waiting for an engineer visit, or whatever. I need to give a fairly quick service or I’m going to start losing customers, which would cost me far more than saving that amount on ink.

We buy our genuine Mimaki inks from the same place we bought our printer (i-Sub digital). Now I know that I can probably buy the same thing elsewhere for a bit less, but I don’t because of the service we receive, which has been above and beyond the call of duty. Now, if they are not selling me the ink on a regular basis would they been so keen to help? When we had a difficulty, instead of getting instant attention we got, "Andy is tied up and can’t get to you until Thursday", it would cause us serious customer service problems and, again, would probably result in loss of customers.

On top of that, there is always trouble with split responsibility. Problem arises and the ink manufacturer blames the printer, and the printer manufacturer blames the ink. The rights and wrongs of that don’t matter to me in the slightest. The fact is that I am out of production whilst they argue about it, and the result would probably be that neither of them will accept responsibility and it will end up costing me regardless. As it stands, i-Sub are responsible for every aspect of our print, so all I ever have to do is to make one phone call and it is sorted.

No, if it works for you that’s great but, on the whole, I’d rather charge five percent more than a competitor and not have the worry or hassle.

[Shane Drew]

My techink is supplied by my printer Dealer who is also my service centre, so I’m covered there 😉

[John Childs]

I refer my esteemed friends to this thread. 😀

https://www.uksignboards.com/viewtopic.p … 198#347198

[John Thomson]

This argument comes up again and again.

I think talking in percentages can mask the issue.

If you run a JV33 in a busy sign shop you may replace each cart 3 times a month? So 8 carts replaced 3 times each a month will cost approx £23040 plus vat a year to run Mimaki ink………run Colorific or similar aftermarket ink and you will spend half that…..almost enough annually to buy your shop a new printer each year.

John

[Shane Drew]

Clearly John, OCE are trying to pass the buck. the comment that it is "an OCE cs9060 printer which is basically a re badged Mutoh 1604 however I cant use Mutoh inks I have to use OCE’s own inks as Mutoh’s don’t work"

Then he says ”Now though OCE are saying that there is nothing wrong with the cartridges and it must be the machine”… but the machine IS an OCE?

Either way its an OCE issue isnt it?

Frankly, using 3rd party inks is not the issue. If you maintain your machine, then I doubt you’ll have too many issue.

I had issue with Ritrama material. I called the distributor out and he thought it was my inks as it was an easy "out" in my mind.

I printed the same file on 3M material and it was fine. Ritrama replaced the roll and it did it again. They said that was proof that it was the ink. I disagreed and asked them to explain why the ink would print on a Ritrama one month, then the next month iy wouldn’t.

They decided to give me another roll, and that also had problems. They admitted to having similar complaints from other different ink users, so recalled the rolls.

I’ve not used Ritrama since even though they tell me the issues have been resolved.

End of the day, a good quality ink should make no difference to any of the major brands of printers. The problem arises when the heads are not maintained and the pumps are not primed etc.

Its easy to blame the ink, but in most cases it is the maintenance or lack of it that causes the issues in the first place.

In Jasons situation, I can’t see how OCE can remove themselves from the issue. Id pay the engineer from OCE to come out, prove them wrong or fix the machine.

Depending on the ink, and if the tubes are OK with the material going thru it, there should be no real problems encountered. Chipped cartridges are the only consistent issue I’ve heard of, and that is a well designed sales decision by the machine manufactures so they dont lose the revenue of overpriced inks from a captive market.

When I upgraded techink here warranted my machine against any issues for 6 months I think. If its going to fail it will fail early on.

[John Childs]

quote Shane Drew:

Clearly John, OCE are trying to pass the buck.

That’s right Shane. Which was my point. 😀

Everything you say is true but, whatever the rights and wrongs, I just don’t need that aggro.

[John Childs]

quote John Thomson:

think talking in percentages can mask the issue.

Can’t agree John.

Assuming your figures are correct, how much print are you going to churn out in a year? Acres of the stuff.

But the difference between ink costs will still be five per cent.

[Bill McMurtry]

quote John:

That’s great Bill. So you’ve reduced your ink costs from five per cent of your print sale price to half a per cent.

I don’t think in per print ink costing. But I’d rather cut a check for $300 than for $3000 when it’s time to restock ink. My business is small so it makes a big difference. Also, I don’t like getting ripped off with inflated OEM ink prices and shady scare tactics to force compliance. Guess I’m a rebel 🙂

[Shane Drew]

quote Bill McMurtry:

Guess I’m a rebel 🙂

Your Tasmanian Bill, that’s a given isn’t it? :lol1: :lol1: 😳 😉

Only joking of course 🙂

John, Jason’s scenario could apply equally to Mimaki or any of the others.

I know a sign shop locally that wants to go bulk because the JV33 he purchased has ‘issues’ and his dealer is less than helpful. At present he buys all his genuine ink from the same people he purchased the machine from, but the dealer knows he has him by the short and curlies because he’s the only dealer that is close to the shop that can supply ink or service quickly.

At least if he purchased ink elsewhere the dealer might work harder to keep his remaining business…. I doubt it though. The dealer is less than helpful at the best of times.

[John Childs]

I hear what you (and Bill) are saying Shane and, like I said, if it works for you, then that’s great, and I’m pleased for you.

I also sympathise with your local JV33 man who has a rubbish dealer, but that’s not the position I am in. I’m also not on the receiving end of any shady scare tactics to continue using original inks – I use them because it is to my advantage. I have a great relationship with my dealer, who does me proud, and it would be to my disadvantage to jeopardise that.

For example: I had a problem matching a specific colour a couple of weeks ago. It was the first job for a new client who’s work I had been chasing for over ten years (seriously) and it looked like I was going to let them down. i-Sub Andy stayed late at work and profiled the colour for me, emailed me the result, and we got the job out on time. So, now we have a new customer who buys twenty vans per year thanks to him. Am I going to repay that by buying ink elsewhere?

Maybe things are different in Oz, but I’m not aware that there is any way here that I could reduce my ink price by ninety per cent as Bill has done. I don’t know for sure, but I would guess that the best achievable might be fifty per cent. That would reduce my costs by £1.50 per square metre.

You know the type of work we do Shane, and the type of clients we serve, and I don’t think that that sort of saving would compensate us for a potential reduction of service from our dealer, increase in printer downtime, loss of accountability, and potential loss of a large client.

[Shane Drew]

Fair comment John. and I agree 100%. You are at a level of service that most of us aspire to, and the professionalism I saw with you and your staff was up there with the best I’ve ever seen anywhere. It was one of the highlights of my trip (one of many), for which I often discuss with my peers here.

I guess, if you are in the market the bulk of the smaller shops seem to find ourselves in, any savings are an advantage over any given year.

As a wholesaler as well as a retailer, any savings I can pass on that can make me more competitive, or conversely, improve my profit margin, has got to be a good thing.

[Bill McMurtry]

quote Shane:

Your Tasmanian Bill, that’s a given isn’t it?

You got me there :lol1:

As usual, it’s each to there own and whatever suits best. One thing I will add is that I can’t imagine being on carts with my JV3. I can see how carts might be the tidy option for a wee desktop, but bulk ink is surely the best option with these large printers. With a bulk ink system there’s just no way to run out of ink halfway through a print run of any length.

[John Childs]

quote Bill McMurtry:

With a bulk ink system there’s just no way to run out of ink halfway through a print run of any length.

That was a concern with the JV3 Bill, but the JV33 uses one cartridge at a time, then automatically switches to the second when the first runs out.

So, no running out of ink, whatever the length of print, because empty cartridges can be changed on the fly so you’ve always got at least one full one installed.

I guess that, in theory, it would be possible to keep a JV33 running for twelve months. Provided that you start with a long enough roll of vinyl. 😀

That is one of the major benefits of the 33 over the 3. That and the fact that it is a lot cleaner machine to operate and things don’t get anywhere like as gummed up with ink.