3rd Party Inks

[Kyle Bennett]

We’re moving to third party inks as soon as our current ones run out, was reluctant but another signmaker we know is now using them on the same printer as ours and has had no problems what so ever.

Also it means we no longer have to deal with a certain supplier who’s been trying to royally lift us recently

[James Langton]

just out of interest kyle. What machine are you running and inks do you plan on switching to. Iv always been told to stay well away from 3rd party but that was from a mutoh dealer.

[David Rowland]

as i have posted many times before.

If you are willing to accept the risk that the ink ‘could’ possibly screw your heads up and you may need to seek 3rd party repairs and if under a maintenance contract with your machine you may have a clause that recommends that you use the original ink.

If you are outside of maintenance contract and do your own repairs and willing to accept the colour difference that the ink may have over your ink, then go for it.

Some people recently have been having trouble printing greyscale images, well that is mainly because the ink isn’t being fired correctly to match the media, one of the reasons could be the ink is slightly differently coloured.

[Kyle Bennett]

quote James Langton:

just out of interest kyle. What machine are you running and inks do you plan on switching to. Iv always been told to stay well away from 3rd party but that was from a mutoh dealer.

I’ll find out Monday morning, my partner mentioned them to me today and I completely forgot as usual

Way I see it is the printer manufacturers don’t make the inks anyway, so the chances are these come from the same factory at the end of the day, and why would the 3rd party suppliers knowingly sell you duff ink? They’re not stupid and realise ink is worth massive amounts in repeat custom.

Hell, half the printer manufacturers don’t even produce their own print heads, so how the hell can they claim only "their" ink works safely in them?

[Shane Drew]

James, I changed my Roland to TechINK bulk systems many years ago, and my second machine was changed over at delivery.

It has a lot to do with the pigments. Techink are an OEM manufacturer for Mutoh I think, so their ink would be OK.

Dave is right to a degree. Some inks will damage heads faster because being a bit course, the pigments act like sandpaper. The more course the pigment, the more damage over time. The more course the pigment, the lower the quality, the cheaper the product.

I’ve been thru 3 heads in nearly 5 years using TechINK, which I think is excellent. The ink is 50% the cost of Rolands ink, but maintenance costs are lower, from my own experience.

Unfortunately, your reasoning that ink manufacturers wouldn’t sell duff ink is not true. They know that some buy purely on price, so they target that market.

I know one sign shop in America that used a well known ink and went through 9 heads. He saw a post from me stating I’d been through 3 over the same period. He decided to try my inks, and eventually changed to TechINK and has never looked back.

Thing is, the other ink was way cheaper than TechINK, but over the years, replacing all those heads made the savings on ink worse than what I was spending over the same period.

Hope that helps mate.

[Chris J Giles]

I know a lot of printer owners happily using 3rd party inks and also a fair few using OEM inks who would never consider changing.

The better 3rd party inks are ‘guaranteed’ by the manufacturers so I would always suggest seeing a copy of that guarantee. Most reputable suppliers will have engineers available to sort out any problems on-site at their cost.

If you have a warranty with the printer manufacturer they will usually tell you that your warranty is invalid if you use 3rd party inks, which I suppose is fair enough if you end up sticking the wrong sort of ink in and trashing your pipes or heads or printing incorrect colours. What they should in fact state is that your ‘wet’ parts (ie. any part that comes into contact with the ink) won’t be covered, but that the rest will be.

I think that if your machine is up for warranty renewal you should look seriously at 3rd party inks and possibly warranty too from the same supplier if available. The savings on the inks would more than likely pay for the warranty and then some. Ask for reference sites using the same printer and inks that you can get an opinion from.

Hope this helps.

[Ali Osman]

quote Chris J Giles:

If you have a warranty with the printer manufacturer they will usually tell you that your warranty is invalid if you use 3rd party inks, which I suppose is fair enough if you end up sticking the wrong sort of ink in and trashing your pipes or heads or printing incorrect colours. What they should in fact state is that your ‘wet’ parts (ie. any part that comes into contact with the ink) won’t be covered, but that the rest will be.

Hope this helps.

Well that’s sort of illegal saying that, you can use whatever brand of inks and it will not affect your warranty. It’s a bit like a car manufacturer expressly dictating which brand of petrol you have to use and the same as the car manufacturer invalidating your warranty if you dont have it serviced by their approved garage, this was outlawed years ago.

http://www.graphicsystems.bplightbrigad … rights.php

[Robert Lambie]

do you run uniform machines yourself ali?

[Peter Normington]

Ali, of course B&P would say that wouldnt they?
If you put oil into a ford car that doesnt meet their specs your warranty is void, No you do not have to have a service done by ford but it has to be done to their standards and using parts that meet certain requirements.
Pattern parts are outlawed in most european countries now and only oem parts can be used, and its the same with any product. No, you dont have to use the manufacturers, or recommended ink, but you cant just use any rubbish and still expect the warranty to be valid.
The difficulty is proving the specs of third party inks are upto the required specs, if for instance I used some rubbish ink in a new printer and the heads clogged up, do you really think the manufactures of that machine would fit new heads under warranty? and get you up and running again quickly and without charge.?

You would be the one trying to prove the claim, and unless you had quite a bit of money to waste, then you would be the one to loose out.

A manufactures warranty is only what they offer, and they are within their rights to set terms and conditions, for you, to keep the warranty valid.
If you do not adhere to the terms they can void a warranty.

Commercial consumer law is quite different from retail consumer law.
so my advice to anyone is to be aware that your "warranty" could well be void by using third party inks, and you should be prepared to pay for or take out a third party insurance to cover repairs, unless you are happy to under right your own risk, basically what Chris has already stated

Peter

[Peter Normington]

Just to illustrate what I have said above, one of the supermarkets supplied petrol that had to much sulphur in it, and it did a lot of damage to engines and catalytic convertors, it was the supermarket that had to pay up, not the car makers, even though many were under warranty

Peter

[Shane Drew]

I had a warranty claim on a faulty head before I converted my machine over to techink originally.

Roland took so long to come out, my techink conversion was in before the tech arrived. As soon as he saw the conversion he voided my claim, even tho I could prove the claim was made well before the conversion took place.

Techink honoured my warranty and replaced the head FOC, such was their faith in their product. They were the ones that told me about the actual warranty status only affecting wet parts.

End of the day, it didn’t matter to me because Techink went above and beyond…. but I’d personally wait for the warranty to expire before doing a conversion in future.

[Brian Bollard]

quote Shane Drew:

James, I changed my Roland to TechINK bulk systems many years ago, and my second machine was changed over at delivery.

It has a lot to do with the pigments. Techink are an OEM manufacturer for Mutoh I think, so their ink would be OK.

Dave is right to a degree. Some inks will damage heads faster because being a bit course, the pigments act like sandpaper. The more course the pigment, the more damage over time. The more course the pigment, the lower the quality, the cheaper the product.

I’ve been thru 3 heads in nearly 5 years using TechINK, which I think is excellent. The ink is 50% the cost of Rolands ink, but maintenance costs are lower, from my own experience.

Unfortunately, your reasoning that ink manufacturers wouldn’t sell duff ink is not true. They know that some buy purely on price, so they target that market.

I know one sign shop in America that used a well known ink and went through 9 heads. He saw a post from me stating I’d been through 3 over the same period. He decided to try my inks, and eventually changed to TechINK and has never looked back.

Thing is, the other ink was way cheaper than TechINK, but over the years, replacing all those heads made the savings on ink worse than what I was spending over the same period.

Hope that helps mate.

Who do you get TechInk off in Oz, mate?

[Shane Drew]

AGS is the australian and NZ agents Buddy. Call them on 1300 554 742 tell ’em you saw them on the UKsignboards posts.

Phil Keenan is ‘da man’ but he’s on holidays till mid august. Chris is the other guy to talk to though.

Where are you based mate? Intro yourself in the hello section if you like. Welcome to the boards anyway.

Cheers
Shane Drew

[Brian Bollard]

Thanks Shane I’ll do that.