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Window etch advice needed
Hi, I wonder if someone can give me a bit of advice? I have a job to do next week which is something out of the norm for me…I have been asked to cover the glass fronts of 6 fridge doors with glass etch film which then have to have a logo applied to the fronts of them. The glass doors are approximately 35cm x 65cm each. Would you advise doing them wet or dry application….neither of which i am particularly experienced in doing as its just something I don’t normally do! I have to go into central London too, so, what kind of figure should I charge (90 mins by car)? Any guidance would be appreciated. Thank you. Louise
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39 Replies
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Hi Louise.@t that size i would do them dry.Does the logo have to be cut out of the etch?
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Hi, thanks for the reply…no, the logo can either be cut out or surface mounted. To be honest, it would look better, surface mounted because then you really wont see the bottles of drink behind, at all…not only that, but it is two coloured so it is best to be on the surface. I was thinking that i could probably put the logos on the film even prior to putting onto the fridges? that way maybe it would reduce the risk of air bubbles or worse when pulling back the application tape from the logo? Louise
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quote starkie:would reduce the risk of air bubbles or worse when pulling back the application tape from the logo? Louisehi louse…if your technique is correct applying etch dry, you will not get bubbles…..and you wont get pulling back with tape if you wet the application tape before taking it off the vinyl 😀 go dry….its less time consuming and lets you get on with making more signs 😉
nik
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i would put your etch glass on first louise .That way youve got a hard surface to work on far easier .If you misalign the logo on the etch ittll be very unforgiving. Just a personal opinion 😀
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Thanks Nik….I’m just nervous applying it dry! especially when there’s people watching over me….trying to look like i do this all the time. Perhaps I’ll just take a few pain killers before I start! Or perhaps i’ll open a couple of the bottles for a bit of courage……just as testers…..they’ll only be in the way anyway!
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hmm, very true Brian, I never thought about that……Damn….I’m going to need lots of painkillers….I can feel the tension rising already!
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quote starkie:Or perhaps i’ll open a couple of the bottles for a bit of courage……just as testers…..they’ll only be in the way anyway!
sounds good to me…… :lol1: :lol1:
no seriously…once youve done it dry….you will be well pleased with yourself…and the confidence will be there for the next time you do apply it…..just remember not to drink too much :lol1: :lol1: :lol1: 😉
nik
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use the hing method Louise just take your time youll be fine .The best way to discribe it is hold the vinyl out while you use the spreaderin a kind of corner to corner action
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I would do it wet.
Why?
Because it’s easier and much more forgiving (I’m assuming this is a solid piece of etch vinyl that needs to be applied without any "cut outs". In this case there is no need to apply application tape which is very difficult to remove on a wet application).
The coloured logo van be applied separately – wet if you prefer as this will stick to etch very quickly and you will get the tape off without any difficulty.
Alternatively – apply the etch (wet) on one side of the glass, and apply the coloured logo dry on the other side.
That’s how I would do it 😀
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I’m not quite sure what you mean Brian???? could you be a little bit more descriptive??? Perhaps I’m just being thick…I am blonde but its not natural!
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Hi Phil, thank you….those were my thoughts…yes, one piece of glass etch going on wet without any application tape, and applying the logo on top dry.
How long would i need to leave it before applying the logo though? I think I may have about 10 or maybe 12 fridges to do as there are 2 bars in the club with 3 double fridges behind each one (from memory i think this is correct). So, by the time i have finished the last glass etch, maybe i could be putting on the logo of the first one?
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ok louise ….imagine youve got a rectangle of vinyl ….id put the top edge of the vinyl where you want it to start ..hold the vinyl at a right angle to you moving down the vinyl as you go with your squeegee…pushing the air out as you go
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and another point to remember as andy gorum quoted on an earlier thread……….let the squeegie do all the work 😉
nik
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Right Brian…am with you now! Its late and i’ve had a nightmare week with these clients! had an enquiry for graphics for this nightclub on the Thursday and they needed them installing on the Tuesday…15 graphics…Large graphics. All needed proofing etc. They didnt get back to me with any approval until 7.00 pm on the SATURDAY and then still wanted them Tuesday! anyway I did manage it……and i work all on my own…so its been a really tough week, but they are good clients and i think will prove to be excellent contacts in the long run.
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Well Nik, the squeegie was nowhere to be seen this week when i needed im!
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quote starkie:How long would i need to leave it before applying the logo though? I think I may have about 10 or maybe 12 fridges to do as there are 2 bars in the club with 3 double fridges behind each one (from memory i think this is correct). So, by the time i have finished the last glass etch, maybe i could be putting on the logo of the first one?
Yup – that’s exactly what I would do.
I agree with the others that dry application is much quicker – but only if there is application tape to remove. If you’re not having to remove application tape then there is no advantage in doing it dry, and wet application is much more forgiving.
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quote starkie:Well Nik, the squeegie was nowhere to be seen this week when i needed im!
:lol1: :lol1: :lol1: :lol1:
nik
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The thing is at the end of the day Louise theres no right or wrong way to put it on…its what ever suits you i personally prefer that method because i dont get air bubbles .I sometimes find water causes more problems than its worth especially on smaller pieces of vinyl 😀
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Well guys, guess what i’m going to be doing tomorrow then? practicing my glass etch application skills…..my god, a girl knows how to have a good time eh!
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I’d go wet. If you got no app tape you can see where you have put the vinyl down. Make sure to use overlapping strokes to get all the water out. Once you get confident do it dry. Rob has good videos on installing etch in the tutorials forum.
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I would try applying the first one wet if you feel more confident with a wet application and then go and clean the front of the other ones, come back to the first one and see if it has stuck OK, my only concern with doing this wet might be the cold with them being fridges.
I wouldn’t use a felt squeegee either as you will be able to apply more pressure with a plastic squeegee with a soft edge. I stick a bit of velvet to the edge of a plastic squeegee with double sided tape and find this to be better than a felt squeegee and doesn’t mark the vinyl at all. -
Thankyou for that tip Martin….liking the velvet thing!
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I’m with Phil on this one – if it’s a non-cut panel – always wet & no application tape – guaranteed perfect results.. Use a window washing squeegee to get out the water. It’s fast, won’t mark it either – or use a felt (velvet side) of a (blue) squeegee.
You can apply your logos soon afterwards too.
Dave
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Hi David,
Well….i’ve had a fairly productive Sunday morning….i’ve covered everybit of floor level clear glass i could get to in my house with glass etch (got to get the feel of how it will be on my knees behind the bar!). Definitely prefer the wet method….oh and does anybody know what the weather is like out there now!!!
Louise
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Aslan do a squeegee with felt one side on them and they’re good for window etch, but like Martin said you can make your own.
I fit dry whenever possible but in awkward places wet seems better, but only slightly sprayed, the amount of rapid tac I use just allows for a little repositioning if necessary and doesnt affect the removal of the application tape.
but dry is way better if possible -
Hi Steve, I’ve just been trialing different methods this morning, but the only thing i didn’t try was different application fluids. I just added a couple of drops of baby shampoo to my water, would i be better to us a proper application spray? if so, what do you recommend?
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Re: Application fluid.
It’s all a personal preference.
I normally use one to two DRIPS of cheapo washing liquid per litre and it does really well. Not so soapy that it won’t stick – and not so plain that it ‘pools’ / has a patchy effect.
Have experimented with adding meths to the mix – it does aid adhesion (temporarily breaks down the glue & makes it stickier) but NOT a recommended thing for general work – so I gave up on that fairly quickly.
Also tried commercial application sprays years ago – they’ve probably improved since then, but I was less than impressed with the claimed benefits over the homemade solutions. They WERE better, just not fantastic.
I’m not hard & fast or wet or dry application – just whatever will give me the best, fastest results. And choice of vinyl plays a HUGE part on the "peelability" of application tape from wet applied vinyl, especially on glass. Presently, I’m using Ritrama – their etch film is great for wet or dry & can be peeled fairly soon after a wet application (minutes).
eg. Did 2 windows on Friday with logos & text cut into an etched panel & a fancy border that were 8′ x 3′. Wet application – squeegeed out & tape remove almost immediately, then gone over any ‘bits’ that had excess fluid. IMO – this was the best method for the job – if it’d been mainly free space it would have been a dry application. Horses for courses…
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I too am using ritrama glass etch. I have used it for other uses but i’ve never used it as ‘blanket’ covering. Ridiculous really, but its so much more unforgiving isn’t it. I’m now thinking, ‘shall i cut the graphics in it or not’ i should really have something better to do on a Sunday afternoon!
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"if i was installing" I would definitely do it dry…
cut slightly over sized panels and apply. then trim back. this way you don’t have to worry about alignment issues.Your problem will be "as martin mentioned" the cold glass from the fridge.
Cold glass actually prevents adhesion. applying with water will only make matters worse. (it does depend on just how cold it actually is though)i would suggest taking your roll of etch vinyl with you. if you spoil one its easy replaced.
if fitted dry ide used a felt squeegee or as has been mentioned, a felt/velvet edged nylon squeegee.
at the end of the day you will obviously need to do whats easiest for you.
if this means doing it wet i would suggest using Rapid-Tac 2. you can buy this from "All Print Supplies" in Slough as they are the main distributor in the UK for
it. http://www.allprint.co.uk/
unlike any other application fluid. Rapid tac has chemicals in it to stimulate the adhesive. i have heard that even in very cold weather it works well.i think you can ask for a free sample bottle to try… this would be enough to do the job… but ide buy a bottle to have for things like this cropping up.
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Damn…you’ve got me worried now!!!
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dont worry about it… easy for me to say i know, but…
as i said "it depends just how cold the glass is" if it is very cold i would suggest at least trying one dry first as i said, if its cold it will make the fitting dry easier than normal because the cold reduces the tack of the adhesive.
i remember a few years ago i was fitting graphics to the inside of a shop window. it was about 5pm and the sun was down, there was snow on the ground outside. i was fitting the graphics dry and i could not get them to stick well enough for me to remove the application tape.
i do not think your glass will be just as cold as that but i thought it best to mention it. -
Its going to be inside within the bar area of the club, so I don’t think that it should be too bad really. Also, as the door is insulated, i would hope that its not going to be too cold…….(fingers and everything crossed in anticipation!) I have been trying to access your video on the home page but cant???
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Just an update on my etch glass dilemma from Sunday…..I did the installation today. Not the original 5 fridges (10 doors) but 7….the client lost count of how many they actually had! Fortunately I had pre cut a few spare glass etch panels and logos just in case….my psychic abilities must’ve been working overtime. Anyway, I decided that I would go with the ‘wet’ application option. Proved to be a good move……when i got there, i was working in an area of floorspace at one time that was no more than 2ft square…..it was ridiculous….but I did it and I have to say that they do look stunning. The logos look really good (applied after) especially with the lights on in the fridges…..So if you’re ever in London at The Green Carnation in Soho take a look at my handiwork!
Thank you so much for all your help and advice. I took heed and listened and put into practice….especially the bit about the velvet over my squeegie!
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well done Starkie 😎 never go to London did you not take any pic’s 😎
Lynn
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Yes I did take some….and i was very tempted to take some showing how tight the space was that i had to fit in! I wouldn’t mind but i’m no size 8 little thing! I must say, i feel incredibly sorry for the bar staff, they are going to be terribly claustrophobic….
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Don’t be shy, post the pics 😀 please 😉 A lot of people on here are from Scotland and it’s a long way from London!
OT Just had two weeks holiday in Scotland and the bl@@dy weather!!
around Fort William 😥 -
If I knew how to upload the image to here I would do it![/img]
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Starkie you need to put your pic’s in the portfolio section
Lynn
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Done Lynn! Found the forum and uploaded couple of photos…..no stopping me now!
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