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I need help I was advised to purchase the wrong printer
Is there anyone who could help me. I’ve just started out in the sign
industry producing vinyl ice cream stickers for ice cream vans. I was getting another sign company to print my designs for my and business and was doing well so I decided to take the leap a purchase a wide format printer. Only to find out the prices of the print and cut were over around £7000 second hand.
To cut a long story short I ended up buying a Ncad 750 wide format printer from Dom Global in November. After months of trying to get a good color match using supplied ICC profiles I found out that I need a RIP file that are around £2000 and I’ve payed £3000 for the ENCAD but I also got a cutter and t shirt press.
So I may as well have bought a print and cut machine. I’ve also found out that the printer is a indoor printer and is no good for my stickers as the ink will fade in the sun. I explained all about my business to Dom Globle and he recommended the NCAD 750. I bought the machine through google checkout after our phone calls to taking his advice and I never had a demo of the printer working as it was a long distance sale.I Believe I have been mis-sold the printer as it does not print for out door prints and my business is all out door.
I have asked for a full refund but they told me that cannot refund me as its past the date return. Any advice would be really really grateful.
Cheers
Dom -
19 Replies
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You could change it for outdoor inks but yes you would have been better off getting a used versacamm or something.
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Why did you buy a machine in the first place without seeing it?
Distance is never an excuse and maybe if you had done a little more research rather than just thinking about profit margins you wouldn’t be in this situation?
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Got to agree with John, seems strange to pay all that money and not do any homework 1st. This is one of the pitfalls of trying to start a company with little or no knowledge in the industry concerned.
Cheers John
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I wasn’t thinking about profits it was all a could afford,I put all my money into it and now I’m struggling financially. I am a ice cream man full time and trying to get into the sign business full time so i can do the job i enjoy. As for buying it I took Dom globals advice and yes granted i should have researched about the NCAD before I bought it. But I took his word as this is the printer for me.
I’ve made a mistake but don’t we all, I will learn from it. -
When someone comes to your icecream van and asks for a crap bar of chocolate do you tell them it’s crap? No your a sales man 😉
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A printer is one of the biggest investments for most sign companys and as such when i bought my printer i spent over a month reserching and phoneing various suppliers, going to shows etc etc.
This payed off for me originally i was going to buy a 54" print and cut but after a conversation with one supplier who pointed out i alreday had a 120 wide graphtec cutter, i bought a 74" print only machine.However i am sure you will not make same mistake again but do not see an easy way out of your situation, as he states you have had it to long to return and the problem with going down the path of misold is that from what i can see you bought it on the strength of a phone conversation and he will deny any knowledge of you saying that you where going to use it for outdoor work only.
My best advice to you is to take all the paperwork etc that you have down to CAB as they are very good and may be able to point you in the right direction.
Regards
Russell.
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Hi Dominic, If they won’t take the goods back can you not do what Jon suggested – change the inks. Or can you not just laminate the prints to give them longer life.
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first i would not sell crap and as for the sales man crap the ice cream industry rlies on your regular customers so if i sold them crap they would not come back. Nice to see how you treat your customers. Speaks volumes
about you! -
Cheers John G, will look into that thanks alot
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Cheers Russell-H will do
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I’d say the sales guy saw you coming, as the price is pretty high for such an old machine (here anyway) but its not uncommon for the sales/fleabay guys/girls to engage the mouth without thinking what they were saying.
It is a case of buyer beware… even here in oz, you’d have a hard case arguing your refund. As has been stated, probably should have done your homework better I’m afraid.
The encad does a fantastic photographic print though, and it does have the option of outdoor pigment inks, so not all is lost in that regard. You’d have to laminate them, which is a good idea anyway. http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/21778 … 0_etc.html
You can’t rely on the honesty of people selling secondhand gear anyway, because they often simply don’t know.
Sorry to hear of your bad experience but you can’t really blame anyone but yourself for the problem, as it would have been easy to google the machine details before parting over your money.
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Cheers Mike and Shane you have given me a good few options thank you very much
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Realistically ? you’ve got very little chance of returning the printer – as you are trade, it was a business to business sale, and isn’t covered by the same sort of consumer laws as retail purchases ( the basic idea being that being in the trade, you are supposed to know what you are buying, so you don’t have any right to return it because you bought the wrong thing 😥 )
It may well have been mis sold, but as it would be your word against his, unless you have concrete proof, then you’ll struggle getting any joy there.
A Versacamm print and cut machine would probably be perfect for what you need – messing about with seperate printers and cutters and laminating would be a pain when you can get one machine that will do it all in one go ( I’m assuming ice cream van owners don’t want to pay loads for their ice cream stickers, and having to do everything seperately would add loads to your production time, and you would have to charge more for them ).
I think your only real option is to sell all the equipment you have at the moment and look at getting a used SP300V or similar, otherwise you will just be throwing good money after bad trying to work with what you have at the moment.
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quote Dominic Rea:first i would not sell crap and as for the sales man crap the ice cream industry rlies on your regular customers so if i sold them crap they would not come back. Nice to see how you treat your customers. Speaks volumes
about you!Interesting reply Dominic…… If a morbidly obese man asked you for an ice cream, would you sell him one?
If someone wanted a flavour you didn’t have, would you try and convince him of a different flavour?
Of course you would Dominic, because even tho you only sell ice cream, you are in effect a salesman….
We all rely on repeat business, but end of the day, we give the customer what they want.
Clearly you wanted a cheap printer because thats all you could afford. We were not privy to the conversation between buyer and seller, but you may very well have given the seller the impression that you didn’t want to pay a lot of money.
He wasn’t obliged to tell you about the RIP or anything else if you didn’t ask. You wanted a cheap printer, and the seller sold you one.
Technically, with outdoor inks, it can do outdoor signage, so he has not misled you there. If you asked if it needed a RIP and he said no, you’d have an argument, but if you didn’t ask, he was under no obligation to tell you. I accept that morally e was, but if you didn’t ask he didn’t have to tell you. That’s what sales men do. That’s why its buyer beware.
My father has diabetes. If he bought an ice cream from you and it sent him into a diabetic shock, who’s to blame? You because you didn’t advise him that it was full of sugar, or dad because he assumed it had no sugar in it?
No offense meant mate, but all there are two sides to every story. As a sign guy and salesman, I will do my best to accommodate everyone, but if someone wants cheap, Ill give them cheap, but I won’t sit there and go thru the pros and cons of their decision.
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Thank you Shane
That was my point exactly (mine was a little shorter though 😉 )
I’ve bought a printer and an embroidery machine lately but I did my research for nearly 6 months on each and visited many suppliers even if it ment traveling far and wide
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Shane that comment was only directed at John i was grateful for your comments but I aim to give the customer what they ask for and if they have diabetes they know if they are aloud it or not its there choice with all the information they have. If they tell me what they want and explain there situation i would advise them not too.
I told them at Dom Global what i was producing and he said this is the right printer for me and like a fool I took his advice. -
quote Dominic Rea:Shane that comment was only directed at John i was grateful for your comments but I aim to give the customer what they ask for and if they have diabetes they know if they are aloud it or not its there choice with all the information they have. If they tell me what they want and explain there situation i would advise them not too.
I told them at Dom Global what i was producing and he said this is the right printer for me and like a fool I took his advice.Domonic, I’ve just been on to the Dom Global site (I should be in bed but I won’t sleep anyway :() and the Encad advertised is actually a Microtec clone of the encad, according to the ‘brochure’ they offer as a download.
Also, the instructions to print make no mention of needing a RIP. Its states;
.If you are using a serial interface, make sure that the RS-232/422 settings match the requirements of your hardware and software. (See Appendix B of this guide.)
If you are using a Windows application, be sure the Print Manager is OFF. Turn off the PDF 文件使用 "pdfFactory Pro" ?用版本?建 http://www.fineprint.com.cn
Print Manager with the YINGHE Windows driver.
File will not print
If you are using a serial cable, check that it is YINGHE PN 203977 for PC and Unix systems. Be sure that RS232/422 settings in your software match those on your printer. If you are using a parallel cable, be sure it meets the specifications of IEEE 1284.
Check your electrical connections.
From your software application, print to a file and send the file to the printer in DOS using the DOS Copy command. At the DOS prompt, type COPY /b filename portname (LPT or COM port). Alternately, use the GO.EXE program. To print the file, type GO filename. This program is supplied on your Utilities disk and can also be downloaded
from the YINGHE web site. In Windows 95/98, you can use the EFPU, available on the System CD.
Slow printing under Windows
Windows applications naturally print slower than DOS applications. Be sure the Windows Print Manager is turned OFF.Having read this and checking out a few other things, I’d be asking to speak to the powers that be, or discussing this with a solicitor.
They are, to my mind, not being totally honest with you, if they have suggested a RIP is required, but imply in the paperwork that it will print directly from windows.
Just my take now that I’ve looked into it a bit more
Take care mate.
Shane
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If he specifically said the printer will print outdoor quality prints as it comes then you may stand a chance in the small claims court, otherwise that’s it really. Not knowing it needed a RIP, laminator, dedicated software etc etc etc is all down to you really mate.
I do feel for you though mate. Here’s an analogy:
If us sign guys went out & bought Ice cream vans without doing the slightest bit of research, only to discover that we needed a £2000 Mr. Whippy maker, we’d only have ourselves to blame for assuming the van came ready to roll.
However, had we spoke to a sales guy from Mr. ICE (ice cream van makers) Ltd & asked for an ice cream van that was capable of a 5 hour round only to discover, that once delivered, the freezer in the van only lasted 3 hours & therefore not the right tool for the job specified, we’d be rightly p1ssed off & want it sorting or our money back.
Unfortunately, I’m guessing it’ll be a case of your word against his – but focus on the fact that it’s not fit for external signage & forget the RIP thing. You may get them to convert it to outdoor inks as an act of goodwill.
Good luck!
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