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Flatbed printers – info for the uninitiated –
I’m looking into flatbed printers for a specific function and need advice.
We make acrylic (perspex) windshields for boats, that must endure similar environments to outdoor signs.
Our customers want to get the look of automobile windows and windshields by adding the black borders that have decreasing amounts of dots as they cover inward (I’m sure there is a name for the actual pattern, but the word for these borders is Frit)
The problem is that (a) we have a great many different windshields in short runs of say 12-20 per run, and (b) They go anywhere from 12″ x 24″ to 30″ x 60″ pieces where you’re just printing the border. Both these factors make it uneconomical to screen print and vinyl eventually falls off.
A possible solution is a large format flatbed printer. I’ve seen many out there and while it seems that UV printers are the coming thing, their price is still prohibitive.
I know little about inks but I wonder what is the problem with solvent-based inks. Do they attack perspex? Do they take too long to dry?
It does seem like we could buy a solvent based printer for a lot less. We’re not in an all-fired hurry since we wouldn’t even be printing every day (I notice lots of posts where it’s a problem if these printers are not used frequently)
I’m sure that if we do the frits, then the customers will want full color logos at an extra charge.
At present we kiss-cut the paper with the laser, pull it off and paint a solid border using Krylon fusion paint. The only other aspect is that we take the painted perspex, heat it to around 300F and form the painted windshield.
I’m prepared to spend maybe us$30-50K on such a printer and the math would still work for me.
I would be most appreciative of any input on this! can I get a solvent-based printer for this price? will solvent-based inks work? -
6 Replies
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how thick is the perspex your printing onto mate?
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Mostly 1/4″, 3/8″ and 1/2″ I did see that clearance on some of these printers is 3/8″
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I posted a similar response in a related topic in the printing forum yesterday, as I have also been looking into a flatbed printer.
I was told that the solvent flatbeds can print on limited substrates, like ultraboard or something that the ink can actually soak into. I was told that the solvent inks will not stick to materials like acrylic, corrugated plastic, or aluminum because the ink “pools” on the surface. You should probably be shopping for a UV flatbed, but they do cost considerably more. I am by no means an expert on these printers or inks, so talk to a supplier to get the info you need, but a good place to start might be Colorspan (colorspan.com). They sell a flatbed solvent for around $50,000 but are running a special right now and you can get it for about $35,000 with some extras. They also sell the UV Flatbeds that start at I think $90,000 but can print on almost anything.
Hope this info helps, good luck!
Doyle
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I would not print these directly , I would use a laser to both engrave the pattern and then cut the screen with the laser too. Colour fill the engraved dots for a totally permanent solution , a 100w large format laser like from kern systems or the like would be within your price bracket and would be a far more productive tool than a printer in your line of work. I have a direct solvent printer and it does not work on pex unless the pex is coated and the heat used for drape forming etc will do the print no good at all. UV inks are not flexible and that would also be a problem if forming the item. Another option it to print the “frit” on a very high quality clear strip and apply it after the windscreen is formed. A decent vinyl will probably last at least 5 yrs , especially if you print and laminate and then cut. The clear will not be noticeable due to the “frit” pattern.
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Thanks for the feedback, guys! While it’s not what I wanted to hear it sure keeps me from pouring $$ into a piece of equipment that won’t do the job!
I see Rodney’s point about considering a film. The underlying issue is competitiveness. A couple of competitors are using what appears to be screen printing because there are no lines that would indicate a film. If I used a film and it starts coming off I’d be run out of town.
I’m starting to think that I should only offer a screen printed frit on longer production run items because of the cost, then wait for Doyle to get the UV
We tried some screen printing inks for acrylic from Spraylat and you’re right, they sorta melt when re-heated.
PS Rodney: I’ve got a thread going in the CNC section and I was hoping you’d chime in with an opinion as to whether I should go for a ballscrew vs rack & pinion CNC? When evaluating I used an old post of yours with some very good advice! -
Just had someone pitch in with another possible solution:
A heat trasfer tape with the imprint of the frit that you apply, heat and peel off the supporting tape. They tell me that it won’t come off.
I googled it and find that sublimation won’t attach to uncoated perspex. I wonder if it’s something akin to the old letraset rub-offs with better chemistry. Anybody know if there is such a thing on the market?
Boy! I’m so off topic that I’m in the wrong forum!
😳
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