Copyright Problem

[Rodney Gold]

The sad news is that it is your problem , had the customer supplied the graphic and you just executed the job , you would be home free. Easiest way to make this a win-win thing is strip the graphic at your cost , apply something else and ask him to tell Scania he has removed the offending graphic.

[Aaron & Chris]

hi

Phoned the Scania Guy and hes alright about taking the offending graphics off and replacing them. We also said we will do it at our cost. 🙁

He’s also going to inform Scania about removing the graphics.

Just wondering what could Scania do next if they feel that is not enough and could this again come back to us, even after removal?

Cheers for the help

Chris & Aaron

[Gary Davis]

Unable to offer advice, however this is an interesting thread, Rodney do you mean they would have to give you the file ?

If someone comes in and asks for say the scania logo on there truck, do they have to source the file for you to be in the clear? (unlikely customers would be able to obtain cut-ready logos!) Or if they ask you to and you vectorise it then are you liable?

[Aaron & Chris]

hi

Phoned the Scania Guy and hes alright about taking the offending graphics off and replacing them. We also said we will do it at our cost. 🙁

He’s also going to inform Scania about removing the graphics.

Just wondering what could Scania do next if they feel that is not enough and could this again come back to us, even after removal?

Cheers for the help

Chris & Aaron

[Bill Dewison]

9 times out of 10 copyright action is taken with a simple cease and desist notice to begin with. Rarely do companies want to down the route of legal action immediately, especially against small firms. It can be an expensive process and the likelyhood of them getting a large payout at the end of it, well its just unlikely.

If you’ve agreed to replace the graphic and wording with the customer, Scania will probably leave it at that. The only way of checking this would be to ring Scania direct and ask, but it kind of highlights you as the guilty culprit. At the moment they’re directing their comments to your customer, it may be better to leave it that way.

Cheers, Dewi

[Aaron & Chris]

Cheers Rodney & Dewi

You have put our minds at ease and our under wear (i think) may live to fight another day.

Hopefully that will be the end of it!! 😀

PS Downloaded that terms and Conditions for sign companies and it shall always now be signed!! 😉

Cheers again

Chris & Aaron

[Shane Drew]

Dewi is right.

Let scania deal with your customer. Don’t get any more involved than you have to.

Scania can ask no more than that you remove the logo. They do not have a legal basis for anything else unless they can prove that your actions have damaged their reputation. I suspect they would only have that argument with the repair guy anyway.

I do a lot of business with Cummins here. The lesson I have learnt when dealing with anyone requesting a corporate logo, be it cummins or anyone else, is get the request in writing.

It is better if they give you a legal letter from the logo owner, or distributor that represents the logo owner. The error here is that you have effectively given the repair guy an ‘authorised look’ when he may not have been authorised at all. That is what Scania would be most concerned about as all these companies are very protective of their reputation.

By having the request in writing, you are within your rights to charge for the removal and correction, if any thing is disputed about the use, and it may go some way to convince the logo owner that you were acting in good faith.

I also doubt that scania will take it any further because you have shown a willingness to conform to their request, which will be in your favour. If you dispute the action you will get their back up, and then you would probably open a can of worms that you wished you hadn’t

Cheers

[Aaron & Chris]

Your right DSI

Kind of scares you when you hear a big name coming looking for you! 😮

If you would have seen the design there is nothing really to pick at. We stayed away as much as possible from Scania but unfortunatly the repair guy wanted to keep the theme. We warned him but stupid us with nothing in writing. We had only just registered our company that week and still had odds and ends to tie up!!

Wont make this mistake again!! 😉

Dont suppose anyone else had the same experience??

Cheers

[Ian Higgins]

What terms and conditions???
Cheers
Ian

[Shane Drew]

quote arch-digital:

Dont suppose anyone else had the same experience??

We have a pretty famous Holden (General Motors) race car driver here called Peter Brock.

He is heavily tied up with the Holden Special Vehicle (HSV), and they have a pretty distinctive logo.

As you can imagine, every boy racer with a V8, wants to be associated with the man, as he is an icon in the sport here. It was great business for sign shops to ‘fill the need’ and produce the HSV logo until just about every sign shop I know, got a very stern legal letter, stating in no uncertain terms, that to continue the practise of producing unauthorised logos, would mean certain bankrutcy.

I got the message pretty quickly, but there are still some in the industry that are calling their bluff.

Cheers

[Shane Drew]

quote Higgi29:

What terms and conditions???
Cheers
Ian

PM rob and he’ll point you to the link I’m sure

Cheers

[Rodney Gold]

We never query the legalities of using a logo if the customer requests it and gives it to us
It’s kinda like a telephone co , they provide the service but arent responsible for what folk say over the lines or any damages caused by the conversation. It’s impossible for you to police copyright or even attempt to find out whether the customer is allowed to use it. At the end of it all , you arent the one messing with the complaining co’s image , its the guy that gets the benefit of using it. However in this case , you took it on yourself to use a partial logo so IMHO should take the rap. In any event , you have done your utmost to set things right by removing it , and as Dewi says , it’s highly unlikely Scania will pursue it at all , it would be pretty silly of them to tie up resources and indeed to even prove or quantify damages. If I were in their position , your actions in removing the offending logo speedily would make me respect you more. Your customer will be as impressed as you have reacted instantaneously at no cost to him etc etc.
Just as a matter of interest , DSI , I drive a Chev El camino pickup which is actually a 1974 Holden Hq ute , with a 308 motor, Yella Terra heads and a few other mods. I love it when those yuppies in their “Eurotrash” or “Rice Burning” hot hatches or Beemers pull up next to me at the traffic lights , raybans glinting , the hot blonde tanned chick in the passenger seat and they get totally humiliated on the pull away. I can just see em , male egos deflated explaining to the bird that they woulda beat me but they missed a gear (Yeh Mine is DEFINATELY bigger than yours:) Ah V8s , I love em. Just waiting for my old Vette to come back from the paint shop , nothing as beautiful and curvaceous as a stingray- sigh!!!!

[Bill Dewison]

A Corvette StingRay! 😮 Now I’m jealous 🙄 😕 😥 😥

Chris – Aaron, as Rodney has said, your swift action and the fact you haven’t charged the customer can only benefit you. Scania will be happy that its been dealt with in a speedy manner and they don’t have to wake up the solicitor and your customer should be over the moon that he’s back in business with little more than a wagging finger from Scania.

I did a toy shop sign, both front and back, a while back. The copyright side was a minefield as for every image on the sign it had to be spot on, in colour, context and in the case of a huge Barbie image, I had to ensure it was laid out in a particular way. The fact that the toy shop is visited regularly by the manufacturers of the toys, it had to be right. Although I appreciate its tempting to bypass certain steps when doing a graphic for a van or sign, its always worth considering the implications should you get pulled up on it at a later date.

Again as Rodney has said, when a customer supplies a graphic, legally its thier responsibility, but when you originate and you use a trademarked logo, even if you alter it 60% or more, if its recognisable even in the slightest you’re going to get a minimum of a ear bashing. There was a case in America were a small to medium sized firm used a similar format in their logo and advertising to a very large software company. They recieved the standard cease and desist, ignored it and within a matter of a few months they were out of business due to spiralling legal expenses. Not good 😕

Glad you’ve sorted it all out now though, I can only imagine what you must have felt like when you were told about it. A real trouser changing moment to say the least :lol1:

Cheers, Dewi

[Aaron & Chris]

Well definatley an experience we dont want to have again!!

Cheers 😀

[Dayi]

Hi all

We have also been at the wrong end of the copyright laws recently,

we made some snap-on logo’s for a guy think we made roughly 10 or so for him, un known to us he was then selling them on ebay the first we knew about it was when a letter dropped through the door from snap-on uk advising that they were going to take us to court, unless we advised them where we got the logo from, how we were going to compensate snap-on and we had to surrender any more copy’s we had, needless to say we did as we were told and haven’t heard anything else from them.

[Shane Drew]

Rodney, a ’74 HQ ute! You’re kidding.

The old 308 HQ is still being raced here by on our circuits. Until a year or two back they were a support race at the INDY.

A vette owner too.

Price of fuel must be cheaper there than here 😥

You meet anyone with a v8 now days around these parts and you immediately assume them to be wealthy 🙄

Shane

[Simon Clayton]

A company i used to work for did all the Kodak shops etc internall and external signs .
They have or had back then, a large legal department, and even though we had there corporate logo manual (about 2″ thick) giving you all the layout info and calculations from a 50m long sign to a printed biro, they still required site photos and sign drawing to check the legality of it all.
I suppose that way they couldn’t be done, or us.. Better safe than sorry!!
Simon

[Shane Drew]

quote Simon C:

A company i used to work for did all the Kodak shops etc internall and external signs .
They have or had back then, a large legal department, and even though we had there corporate logo manual (about 2″ thick) giving you all the layout info and calculations from a 50m long sign to a printed biro, they still required site photos and sign drawing to check the legality of it all.
I suppose that way they couldn’t be done, or us.. Better safe than sorry!!
Simon

Simon, I know what you say is true. We did some Kodak work here about 6 or 7 years ago for one of the theme parks. They actually insisted on a paid Kodak employee being onsite whilst we did the job. We had to explain everything as we did it.

It was way too much trouble given that we had to work thru the night whilst the park was closed. Made a simple job an absolute nightmare.

End of the day, we had to make some changes ‘on the fly’ and the Kodak woman had no idea what to do, so we did it anyway. When we finished, told the theme park not to call us again.

Cheers

[sprint]

quote Rodney Gold:

ut they missed a gear (Yeh Mine is DEFINATELY bigger than yours:) Ah V8s , I love em. Just waiting for my old Vette to come back from the paint shop , nothing as beautiful and curvaceous as a stingray- sigh!!!!

Hi everyone……… had to reply to this, couldnt agree more, just got myself a 76 vette, 350cubic inches of pleasure (and no im not rich!) and ueven with the price of fuel in the UK!