-
Advise on removing old vinyl please?
Just had a job come through from a customer who doesnt want to pay the extra for a new board. The vinyl is impossible to remove. I have thought long and hard about it and thought of the following:
bite the bullet and spend 2 odd days removing the vinyl
or
flood coat it with white vinyl twice over and hope the old text wont show through. The old vinyl to be removed has cracked and is incredibly strong so is proving very difficult to remove. any help would be great!
-
43 Replies
-
Why make this your problem! Give your customer a quote as follows to supply and fit vinyl after he has removed it. To supply and fit vinyl to a new panel.
job done
-
As Richard said – stop pandering to them at YOUR expense….are they going to pay you to peel off the vinyl at an appropriate hourly rate?
Give them the option to peel it themselves & clean it up…otherwise cough up for a new board as let’s face it – you can buy board cheaper then you can strip one…
Dave
-
Quote more for vinyl removal than the cost of a replacement panel, as chances are that it will cost more anyway….. :lol1:
You will soon find out charging extra for vinyl removal is not a bad thing. If you ever feel a job is getting mundane, you didnt charge enough!
-
Liquid vinyl remover. Paint it on, leave and it falls off!
BUT, as the other guys say, it should be the customers problem, not yours!
Matt
-
give em an hourly rate and an idea of how long it will take to remove, then give em the price for a new set of panels, then give em the option to buy new panels or remove/clean themselves as you simply don’t have a few hours to spare and could more efficiently use your time tha a flat hourly rate at present.
be sure to tell them that any cleaning of glue etc will still be charged hourly with 1hr min so, if they opt to do it, they need to do it well…..
they’ll have new boards.
Hugh
-
Could you possibly letter the other side?
If not, inform the client that you will be happy to re-do the sign after they remove the old lettering.
Or charge your hourly shop rate for removal.
Or flood coat the darn thing and tell them you are not responsible for any bubbles etc.
If they are that cheap they won’t care.Some people just don’t understand that you can’t polish a turd.
Love….Jill -
Hi Jill
When I put ‘polishing a turd’ you put a link to ‘youtube’ to show it can be done!
Contradiction in terms……
Matt
-
Yeah I know they did it on Mythbusters but it’s a favorite old saying.
-
And you held us to a draw, so you win!!!!
😀 😀
-
As has been said regarding prices, but use a hot air gun to soften the vinyl and it will peel off easier.
-
Stuart,
are you really in business as a sign maker?
dont take this the wrong way, but you ask questions on how to do things from the most simple, to the most complex.
you don’t appear to have any basic knowledge of sign production and the sign business in general,
Just wondered if you have an established customer base, or just trying to quote any job that comes your way? and hope the boards can tell you how to do it?Peter
-
Hi Peter,
Thought I would be asked that question sooner or later. I mainly do the printing but have done quite a few shops, once again just print and cut. I am new to the way cut vinyl and layering works and have removed old vinyl before but this particular job has really strong vinyl which has gone so hard that although you use a heat gun and scraper its very brittle. I have removed old vinyl in the past and its come off pretty effortlesly but this is a completely different ball game which i didnt anticipate.
would flood coating the boards 2 to 3 times do the trick?? If i can get scrap vinyl i was thinking of just building up about 2 to 3 layers so the old vinyl doesnt come through?
any suggestions??
thanx all 😀
-
its going to look like a right bodge job flooding over that lot then redoing the lettering.
think you are stuck with either a hot air gun and 2 days work ish but thats ok just charge £200 a day labour (!) can you not do anything with the other side of the board or is both sides visable when mounted !
or renew the lot as the boards cheap enough and will be cheaper than £400 labour cleaning the board up or are you doing that for free !
btw if you use a print n cut why are you trying to do layers with vinyl on that other thread ! if i had a print n cut i think my days of layering vinyl would end straight away.
Heres hoping santa will be nice and try and get a versacam VP-540 or similar down the chimny at crimbo 😛 wife says chimny is too small tho 👿 -
quote :And you held us to a draw, so you win!!!!youve been reading the new york post again matty
-
How big is that board? Isn’t two to three layers of flood coating plus your time and the risk of it looking sh*te going to match board price anyways?
It’s hard to get an idea of scale from the pic, sorry if i missed you mention it somewhere.
Liam
-
Problem is that multiple layers won’t hide the letters underneath. They will just make them show up more.
Peter
-
Had a friend completetly unrelated to the sign industry give me a great idea!!! A fresh layer of 3 mm foamex on top of the boards will do the trick. has to be applied on the current boards as they have aluminium framwork on the back to attach the sign.
thanks all!! 🙂
stu 😀
-
Let the customer have a go at it and at the same time give them the price for a new panel. Depending on how cheap they are it will solve your problem either way . . . :lol1:
I wouldn’t even consider floodcoating it, best to supply a new panel.
-
Layering with another substrate sounds like a failure waiting to happen.
-
Stuart 3mm foam can warp quite easily, and could end up looking bad.
What are the original boards made from?Peter
-
why would you use 1 board to hide another! (bodge job) if you are thinking that way just scrap the old 1 and re-new the lot. job done properly then, seems you are looking to cut corners which very rarely work and will cost YOU more money.
-
quote Stuart Green:Had a friend completetly unrelated to the sign industry give me a great idea!!! A fresh layer of 3 mm foamex on top of the boards will do the trick. has to be applied on the current boards as they have aluminium framwork on the back to attach the sign.thanks all!! 🙂
stu 😀
Are you serious?
-
previous board appears to be made of diabond. was thinking of using pinkgrip to adhere and then screwing the foamex on to the diaboand cut exactly as the diabond. customer just wants it done cheap as poss.
-
is it April 1st here or what 🙄
-
Based on an 8×4.
NEW composite – £35
NEW 3mm PVC – £15
Couple of tubes of pink grip (to give enough coverage) – £5So…to save £15 you will give them a crap looking, inferior job…and it WILL buckle and warp where it’s not stuck down.
You’ve wasted more than £15 of your own time figuring out how to save this guy money…never mind the extra time to bond a sheet.
How cheap does he want it!!
-
Why don’t you just give him a tenner and ask him to go away??
With all these questions its gotta be costing you money.
Just my 2p worth
Gary
-
Definately a better idea but the problem is with composite its going to be difficult to cut round the corners. with foamex i can just use a stanley knife. Dont know what I’m missing here but why would foamex be such an issue when its used all the time in making signage and would it warp even if its used with pink grip and screws??
-
Stuart.
which ever way you do it, you are not saving money, factor your time into the job and you will be be loosing out, just trying to save money for a cheapskate customer.foamex has a high coefficient of expansion, and will be even more prone to distort, if glued and screwed. if you really must go down the route that every one has told you to avoid, then use just a few screws to attach the foamex, use 5mm if possible and with oversize holes and the screws only just biting to allow the foam to expand, no glue.
BTW nitro morse will remove the vinyl, but we are back to time versus material costs.Peter
-
quote Stuart Green:Definately a better idea but the problem is with composite its going to be difficult to cut round the corners. with foamex i can just use a stanley knife. Dont know what I’m missing here but why would foamex be such an issue when its used all the time in making signage and would it warp even if its used with pink grip and screws??
Composite cuts a dream with a jig saw or a router.
3mm foam ISN’T used all the time for external signage…well maybe by cheapskates doing a half-ass job.
YES, it WILL warp…and you have a lot of very experienced signmakers telling you it will, with probably 100+ years of experience…why don’t you want to believe them!
Use a sheet of correx and some screws to hold it on…it’s even cheaper and you can cut it with scissors.
-
quote :Why don’t you just give him a tenner and ask him to go away??
Best suggestion yet.
You have been given loads of good advice.
The cheapest solution can often be the worst one.
How many people are going to see a warped jerry-rigged foamex sign hanging off of the old sign with exposed cracked letters and say "Oh Stuart did those"
It’s not worth it. -
I Don’t Believe it
this thread is on page 4
-
quote Chris Wool:I Don’t Believe it
this thread is on page 4
Just another two pages until we beat "vehicle wrap wet?"
ps. is anybody else getting Roger Clements offsite linked image embedded in with Stuarts offsite linked images in the first post in this thread?
Or has my PC thrown a wobbly?
-
lol. 😀 okay okay!!
wont be using foamex and I did screw up with not anticipating the amount of time very old vinyl can take to remove. It was much easier when i removed old vinyl from a previous job. I think the best i can do (in the current circumstances is use correx board as david suggested)
should this then mean foamex is a cheap alternative but shouldnt be used in signmaking?? I buy foamex from sign suppliers so If it warps then why the hell are sign suppliers selling unsuitable products??
-
David…not a wobbly mate. I seem to have posted my pic incorrectly. I trust the Mods have corrected my error as I was nicely informed I got it wrong….Sorry one and all
-
Correx is going to deteriorate in the sun after about a year.
Correx is only a temporary material.
If the original sign was dibond use dibond, it seems to have lasted quite awhile.
Use the right materials for the job.
Do you want to be known as the cheap guy in town who makes shoddy signs that don’t last?
Even if the customer is a cheap@ss you still should be concerned about how a failed sign will look to potential clients.
I would recommend the customer to my nearest and cheapest competitor.
Some jobs are just not worth it. -
quote :use correx board as david suggestedI am guessing this suggestion from David was a joke. Be very careful what you use and where it’s getting situated. If you use correx and it’s near road, correx blows off causes an accident ‘customer wanted it cheap’ isn’t going to cut it. I don’t mean to be rude or break board rules in terms of how helpful my reply is but you really need to learn the basics before taking jobs on. Foam pvc has its place in signmaking as do lots of other materials. My honest opinion based on your posts is you could sell ice to the eskimos, how else would you land these jobs with no idea how to complete them?
-
[shame mode]
Didn’t expect correx to be taken as a serious suggestion!!
Tongue was firmly in cheek, and much nudging & winking – sorry!![/shame mode]
-
You don’t need customers like this. Sounds like you’re already making a loss. Move on to better jobs and forget about it. I have tried doing every job that comes my way but it’s a waste of time. Also I refuse to sell a sign that will look sh!t within months of it being fitted. It gives me a bad name.
Whatever you do, unless you replace the board it WILL NOT LOOK GOOD. If it’s temporary and the customer doesn’t care then use whatever you like, correx/foamex/papier mache etc, but if it is to be permanent then respectfully tell your customer that you will not supply a sign that gives you a bad name. As has been said before, in a few months’ time the customer will forget that he saved a few quid, but he will see a sh!te looking sign every day and he will remember YOU made it, not that HE asked you to do it on a budget. Good luck.
John
-
quote Stuart Green:should this then mean foamex is a cheap alternative but shouldnt be used in signmaking?? I buy foamex from sign suppliers so If it warps then why the hell are sign suppliers selling unsuitable products??They are not supplying unsuitable products, Foamex is very suitable for a lot of applications if used correctly, just not the one you tryng to do.
I HAVEN’T COUNTED EXACTLY BUT APPROX 20 REPLIES HAVE SAID TO USE COMPOSITE.
I’LL TYPE IT BIGGER FOR YOU!!!!
"USE COMPOSITE"
-
Just so the thread goes on to beat ‘vinyl wrapping wet’…
By the time you read all the replies, posted your own, you could have stripped the boards, re done them and be making money on a ‘proper’ job.
Just a thought…. 😕
-
Now Stuart old chap. Seeing that all these nice people who have taken the time to help you in this thread have all (but one) got avatar pictures so YOU know who are helping you, could you be a decent chap and put your mug up here so that WE know whom we are helping. 170 posts and no mugshot! Fairs fair!
-
Just thought I would mention the solution to my problem was in the shed. caustic soda on the vinyl left for an hour and the vinyl literally just soaked up and slid off!! practically took me 3-4 minutes to take the vinyl off with a scraper but could have used my hands as it was more like wet paper. best thing i’ve come accross yet!!
Hopefully that might be some useful information to someone?? 🙄
-
Hi Stuart! (again!)
Yes it works but at a cost.
You try applying the new vinyl to the newly cleaned panel. (and see it 2 days later!) It will be bubbly all over. In this trade there is no quick fix solution. What works one day will cost in the future, Us guys and Gals are here for a reason….to help and be helped.
Most of us have tried the cheap option to make a cheap buck and payed twice over for the experience. Take head of good advice and don’t See it as a negative…
Oh, and as Mike says, a pic to see you would be good!!
Matt
Log in to reply.
