uksignboards.com | Where can i source 3M, 3630-317 Scotchcal Vinyl please?

Otto Peltonen

Member

24 October 2008 at 18:05

In Finland that costs 1650 € per roll (1,22mx50m), so we’re both being ripped off… but they also sell it by the meter,though.

Robert Lambie

Member

24 October 2008 at 18:15

you maybe able to buy it cheaper from the UK?

there are certain types and brands of vinyl that very expensive and the price doesn’t shock me in comparison to some. the fact your customer is stipulating you use this series of 3M vinyl will mean they are fully aware of the costs and will epect you to charge accordingly.

If you approach a official stockist of 3M you maybe in luck and able to buy half or maybe even a quarter roll. I have managed to do this a few times a while back through WmSmiths http://www.wmsmith.co.uk

Dan Osterbery

Member

27 October 2008 at 10:48

cheers rob,
have received their prices list, and theres not much in it!! Same price + – between uk and here!!

Will have to adjust our margins!!

Thanks

Dan

Stuart Taylor

Member

4 November 2008 at 17:25

Hi Dan

Just got back from a weeks holiday so only just seen your post

I will try and explain this from a 3M Distributor point of view and clarify 3M policy for regional pricing. Generally 3M will set pricing for each product range based on geographic regions split into Europe, Asia, North America, Latin America etc – Taking Europe as the example prices are set for the year in Euros and any country (inc UK) not in the Euro system converts to local currency. However as the £/Euro market has been so volatile in the last 12 months prices were set a year ago when the £/Euro was trading at approx 1.45 – current trading value is around 1.24 today. 3M UK list price is currently £1143 per 50m roll which was around 1650 Euro 12 months ago (the rate confirmed from Finland) and around 1400 Euro at today’s exchange rate.

However most distributors will work on some form of discount structure so if you check out our published 1 roll rate we sell at approx 1275 Euro per roll @ 1.24 Euro/£ and smaller quantities at between 28 to 33 Euro per linear metre – Can’t comment on discounts available in Spain or Finland as it probably depends on their own pricing policy and if they have other 3M distributors that they compete with. So you’re not being done but as you can see there are some price differences partly due to currency fluctuation and partly down to distributor margins.

Don’t know if that helps but let me know if you need any more info or contact me directly if you wish

Stuart

Dan Osterbery

Member

4 November 2008 at 17:32

thanks stuart,
it was just initial shock at the price of the vinyl!! i have got over it now!! thanks for your explanation though!

regards

dan

Aitor Asencor

Member

29 January 2009 at 22:36

The problem is that if you see the 3M prices in US, they are easily the half or third of the price in spain for example. (example: IJ380 or IJ180C-10).

Even I’ve seen offers as buy one IJ380 v3 and get a IJ180C free…

I’d like to use that stuff but is too expensive.

Peter Normington

Member

29 January 2009 at 22:55

the price is always relative to the market, it is no good crying its cheaper in another country, go and start a business in the states then, and see if you can compete ?

Its really of no concern to me, if goods are cheaper elsewhere, I am not trying to compete on an international basis, A 20 mile radius is my market,
so whatever Joe Mac Usa pays doesnt affect me in the slightest.

Peter

Aitor Asencor

Member

29 January 2009 at 23:32

Yeah, you’re right in that, but it’s also three times the price of for example mcfleet (mactac) and probably any other brand as Oracal, hexis,..

So not just about the price in US, also comparing with others brands here.

Peter Normington

Member

29 January 2009 at 23:36

quote Aitor:

Yeah, you’re right in that, but it’s also three times the price of for example mcfleet (mactac) and probably any other brand as Oracal, hexis,..

So not just about the price in US, also comparing with others brands here.

But is it also 3 times the price as others in the usa? if so its playing to the same market, that was my point,

Peter

Aitor Asencor

Member

30 January 2009 at 16:00

Checked prices and in US, IJ 180 V3 is about 20% more expensive than 5529 from Mactac and IJ 380 v3 about 40% more.
The price of Mactac is similar there.
That’s normal prices as IJ 380 seems to be a very advanced vinyl.

So we have to pay almost three times the US price for 3M while other brands got similar prices.
Actually it’d be cheaper to fly to US and buy 2-3 rolls than buy them here.

Really I’d like to check the 3M Distributor point of view and the 3M policy for regional ripoff.

Stuart Taylor

Member

2 February 2009 at 11:47

quote Aitor:

Checked prices and in US, IJ 180 V3 is about 20% more expensive than 5529 from Mactac and IJ 380 v3 about 40% more.
The price of Mactac is similar there.
That’s normal prices as IJ 380 seems to be a very advanced vinyl.

So we have to pay almost three times the US price for 3M while other brands got similar prices.
Actually it’d be cheaper to fly to US and buy 2-3 rolls than buy them here.

Really I’d like to check the 3M Distributor point of view and the 3M policy for regional ripoff.

I wouldn’t normally respond to unsubstantiated pricing reports like made here by Aitor but as I’ve been invited to comment I feel I need to bring some actual facts to the above post

Let me take the IJ380 product as the example (The 3M Premium wrapping product) – The only US Distributor I can see openly quoting 3M figures online is Hyatts (JillBeans may be able to confirm US pricing) but based on their online pricing they are selling at $1053.54 for a 1370mm x 50yd roll – based on todays conversion rate $1.42 to the £1 that works out at £741.93 – IJ380 CV3 has not yet been launched in the UK but the European product (IJ380) that we stock is selling at under £750 per 50 Metre roll – Now as the US product is only 50yd (45.72m) if you do the maths this works out @ £811.38 for a 50 metre equivalent from the US …. in other words the product is more expensive in the US – Finally if you add shipping costs (£££) + import duty (approx 10%) you would be paying over £900 for the US product ! You may have got the US pricing elsewhere but for your comments of a 1/3 to 1/2 the price of here the US product would need to be selling at between $300 and $500 per roll which seems unlikely in view of Hyatts published pricing.

As you may have read in earlier comments from myself 3M do have regional pricing for Europe, Asia, North America and South America but I think the above facts prove there is not a "regional rip off" as you stated.

Obviously I can only comment as a UK 3M Distributor and I am not sure where your US pricing is coming from but it certainly doe not appear to be the 2 to 3 times price difference you state without back up – Not only does it appear way off the mark but on this occasion (with a little help from the $/£ rates) the UK is getting a much better deal.

Regardless of the above pricing I have just responded to I must agree with Peter Normington that it is irrelevant what pricing is in another region anyway as long as the local product price is relevent to local competition.

Stuart

ps apologies Rob if I’ve breached any board rules by quoting rough UK pricing but I felt it necessary to respond when comments such as "regional rip off" were being used

Jon Marshall

Member

2 February 2009 at 23:29

Fair enough but it’s only recently the pound has lost a lot compared to the dollar. I bet the prices were still the same when £1 = $2 🙂

Robert Lambie

Member

2 February 2009 at 23:55

quote Stuart Taylor:

ps apologies Rob if I’ve breached any board rules by quoting rough UK pricing but I felt it necessary to respond when comments such as “regional rip off” were being used

Not need to apologise at all Stuart, The topic was raised first by a member with issues over pricing based on one of your products, so your completely within your rights by defending your corner stating prices, showing graphs, spread sheets even video is allowed if you feel the need. :lol1:

Seriously though… I also have to agree with Peter Normington too… [cant believe I’m saying that out loud! :lol1: :wink:]

quote :

it is irrelevant what pricing is in another region anyway as long as the local product price is relevent to local competition.

Peter Normington

Member

3 February 2009 at 00:06

Rob,
you know you agree with me most of the time, but then we would have nothing to talk about, and that would make life boring 😀
Peter

Aitor Asencor

Member

3 February 2009 at 09:01

I got the prices asking to US wrappers in a forum. Asking for a normal price without any special offer. The normal price they get is about 25% less than the price you mentioned.

And I’m talking about the price here (basque country & spain) and neither the price is the mentioned for the UK. (70% more at least in list price). Yeah, 70% more.
We’re checking with all distributors here to see the final price we could get.

quote :

it is irrelevant what pricing is in another region anyway as long as the local product price is relevent to local competition.

Well, yes and no, obviously with the 3M price here you only have the option to use other brands.

Btw, do you sell to other countries??

Robert Lambie

Member

3 February 2009 at 09:24

quote Aitor:

I got the prices asking to US wrappers in a forum.

No disrespect mate, but come on? two guys on a U.S. forum tell you they can buy this and that for x-amount and you take it as gospel? 😕

I am not saying the prices are wrong, I do not know myself… but what i am saying is… "this is the Internet" so how can you honestly argue out a point without some facts at hand, at the moment this is just hear-say from two guys chatting to you over the internet.

also, you mention they are wrappers, maybe they own a big wrap firm and use tons of the stuff so have negotiated a discount… who knows?

anyway, as i said, not saying the prices quoted are 100% wrong, i just think to quiz someone in public about their pricing over someone else you need to have some solid facts at your end. i would think anyway…

Stuart Taylor

Member

3 February 2009 at 12:00

quote Jon Marshall:

Fair enough but it’s only recently the pound has lost a lot compared to the dollar. I bet the prices were still the same when £1 = $2 🙂

Jon

You’re quite correct that 3M have a policy of absorbing currency fluctuations as much as possible – When a new product is created they will set a regional/worldwide price based on certain assumptions including average/long term currency position – eg if they create a price in the US @ $1000 per roll and take it global they will base the UK price @ say $1.75 per £ as an average which would equal £570 sterling – If the $/£ then moves 2 to 1 the UK price will still remain @ £570 and not drop further to £500, equally as we have now $1.4/£ they price still stays @ £570 in the UK instead of going up to £715.

Not all manufacturers work this way – Ritrama (which we also distribute) base their prices in Euro and have therefore had 14% and 10% price rises in the UK in the last 12 months – As a Distributor I am much happier with the 3M solution which protects the local market from significant currency fluctuation and is absorbed by 3M with a total global view.

The 3M position in the UK obviously supports the local Distributor/Signmaker from global currency shifts – however we have one customer in the UK who purchased his common big movers from the US when the $/£ was at 2 to 1 has now found he is paying considerably more for his product @ $1.4/£1 and now is buying again from the UK.

quote :

And I’m talking about the price here (basque country & spain) and neither the price is the mentioned for the UK. (70% more at least in list price). Yeah, 70% more.
We’re checking with all distributors here to see the final price we could get.

Aitor – regarding your point above I cannot comment on how a Spanish Distributor runs their business or what rate they charge, however they are open to competition in a European market where free trade is allowed without barriers. It is unfortunate at the moment for UK companies importing product from the Eurozone due to the weak £ ….. however this position is reversed when exporting product from the UK to the rest of Europe. To answer your question of do we sell outside of the UK the answer is yes, but we do not encourage/actively seek business outside of the UK (also shipping charges can become an issue dependant on urgency, volume and weight) Although we do sell in other countries it is normally where there is no local 3M Distributor ….. I would first advise that you talk to your local distributors and see if they are prepared to help you achieve your target price before looking to buy from another country. – One final point to note about buying from another country whether that be the US, UK, France, Germany etc is if you have a technical issue the corrective action is much more complex than buying through a local Distributor (though not impossible)

I hope this all makes sense

Stuart

gdarnall

Member

5 February 2009 at 18:04

its $700 for any 3M roll 48"x50m here in US. Montroy.com and signsupply.com

Dan Osterbery

Member

5 February 2009 at 18:29

is that a special offer? I have just looked at montroy website and its 1,175.00 dollars a roll, which is not far off what we pay here?

http://www.montroy.com/catalog/main/cat … at_5=48%22

gdarnall

Member

5 February 2009 at 20:09

maybe it is on a different site. im currently on my internet explorer with 12 different sites who sell vinyl so i might have confused it with another. i will post up the correct site shortly

gdarnall

Member

5 February 2009 at 20:11

http://www.wrapvinyl.com/index.php/3m-controltac-graphic-film-with-comply-v3-adhesive-ij180cv3-10.html?___store=default