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  • Sign Vinyl Fading, how would you deal with the situation?

     Pane Talev updated 1 month, 4 weeks ago 8 Members · 16 Posts
  • Pane Talev

    Member
    June 13, 2020 at 7:06 pm

    Evening all,

    This job is done is 2016. MacTac MaCal 9800
    (8-10 years outdoor life)

    Some parking signs and small light box.
    No budget for translucent vinyl and client was happy to have the same on the light box. Light box is never on, anyway.

    Light box is exposed on the sun during all day from sunrise to sun set.

    Light box has faded a little.

    Client walks on my street and while I put graphics for on another client on his van (client stands near me) and we both hear the complain. “My sign has faded – I was expecting to get more that 4 years out of it”

    I was shocked. In 24 years I never had such a complaint. MacTac is my choice of vinyl only when client insist on a particular colour.

    I went on site and is not a big deal. (But. In a way it is a big deal. This is the first time I see what is sold like 8-10 years vinyl to fade after 4 years. Having said that the same vinyl will have 1 year warranty in Dubai for example.

    Parking sign have not faded.

    To replace this will not cost me a lot of money and time. But, it upset me little, I felt little bullied, the complain was done in a strange fashion and in front of another client.

    Car paint fades (especially red) and yet we dont go back to the dealer expecting free car polish.

    I will change this. Ok. But with what material. This is already 8-10 year vinyl.

    Please write me your toughs

  • Kevin Mahoney

    Member
    June 13, 2020 at 9:24 pm

    I think the 8-10 year label is the timescale the the vinyl will last without breaking down, peeling or delaminating from the adhesive, wouldn’t think it was a guarantee of colour fading as the location it ends up in can’t be compared to others. Yes, it has faded compared to the swatch but not by much, awful thing for your client to do by spouting off in front of another customer, should have said that privately. Overall though, I think the job is still fit for purpose mate, 12 month guarantee is enough

  • Martyn Heath

    Member
    June 14, 2020 at 5:54 am

    Im with kevin. Yes it faded but not a huge amount. Plus your customer is clearly a dick for acting in that way. It wouldnt wash well with me thats for sure.

  • David Hammond

    Member
    June 14, 2020 at 6:04 am

    I cant see the problem?

    As above, the vinyl hasn’t deteriorated, unless you guaranteed it wouldn’t fade, unless in writing, dont replace it.

    It’s still fit for purpose and does the job, if it was so bad they’d have called sooner.

  • Pane Talev

    Member
    June 14, 2020 at 7:34 am

    Thank you for your messages gentlemen.

    This is similar call like “emailing EPS file to client”

    1) Dear client, we require x £ for emailing / releasing you your logo in EPS. Client is maybe upset and maybe goes elsewhere in future.

    2) Or in this case, dear client, the vinyl is still up to scratch and I cannot offer free replacement…. and client maybe goes elsewhere.

    To me main objective here is not about balancing if this is a big or small client and being afraid of losing it.

    It is more about doing the right thing / a fair decision.

  • Phill Fenton

    Member
    June 14, 2020 at 9:17 am

    I think a fair decision is to do nothing. You made this sign 4 years ago and it’s still doing its job. I think you’re over reacting to what was probably a teasing comment. I certainly wouldn’t be re doing the sign.

  • Kevin Mahoney

    Member
    June 14, 2020 at 9:30 am

    If you painted your front door & four years later it’s faded slightly, you wouldn’t demand your money back would you? If the vinyl had bleached out completely then fair comment but if you’re asked to install a sign that’s in direct sunlight all day then it isn’t down to you when it fades a little

  • Pane Talev

    Member
    June 14, 2020 at 9:46 am
    quote Phill Fenton:

    I think a fair decision is to do nothing. You made this sign 4 years ago and it’s still doing its job. I think you’re over reacting to what was probably a teasing comment. I certainly wouldn’t be re doing the sign.
    quote Kevin Mahoney:

    If you painted your front door & four years later it’s faded slightly, you wouldn’t demand your money back would you? If the vinyl had bleached out completely then fair comment but if you’re asked to install a sign that’s in direct sunlight all day then it isn’t down to you when it fades a little .

    If she said that comment with a smile or a smirk I would not taken it seriously. But she insisted I go and see her on site.

    I’m thinking in similar direction. 300k Ferrari will fade, and yet folks don’t expect free polish.

    Thanks all.

    I’ve made my decision. Will not change the vinyl on the sign free of charge.

  • Glenn Sharp

    Member
    June 14, 2020 at 9:55 am

    The issue isn’t whether your workmanship is up to scratch or not – the issue is whether the vinyl is up to scratch or not

    From the photographs I would say that after 4 years in an exposed environment the vinyl is holding up well

    I wouldn’t be offering to redo the work and if she pursues the issue, I’d be asking your vinyl suppliers rep to have a word with her

    Will it clean up at all to regain some of its gloss?

  • Kevin Mahoney

    Member
    June 14, 2020 at 11:31 am

    Not a bad shout from Glen, bit of polish or fine cutting compound may get rid of the oxidisation on the surface but not for you to do for free, the guy who installed her windows won’t be going round to clean them

  • David McDonald

    Member
    June 14, 2020 at 1:08 pm

    Hi All

    How many customers ever clean their signs?

    Never mind colour fading if they bought a brand new car and let it sit outside for 4 years without cleaning or washing it then it would accumulate a patina of environmental dirt that would begin damaging the paint (and they wouldn’t complain because they’d know it was their fault) – I reckon that’ll be the cause rather than any underlying problem with the vinyl. It might buff off to a gloss finish again , or it might not. You haven’t sold them a self cleaning sign! As a gesture of good will then give the sign its first ever clean but no more. Of course if you ask them they’ll tell you they’ve cleaned it every 5 minutes since the sign went up.

    Just my grumpy thoughts.

    Cheers
    Dave

  • David Rogers

    Member
    June 14, 2020 at 1:57 pm

    Short and sweet.

    One year warranty on parts and labour…and a reasonable expectation of lifespan is certainly no more than 3 years if we get into the sale of goods.

    Unless it’s an actual material FAILURE then i don’t entertain idiots wanting a new sign every few years…

    I’ve had 7year 3M bright orange degrade to a pastel shade on a car bonnet within 2 years whilst remaining perfect on the doors…client paid for the repair.

  • David Hammond

    Member
    June 14, 2020 at 2:54 pm

    It still functions as a sign.

    You can still read it, it is still presentable, its fit for purpose.

    No ifs, not buts. Let them get a shitty on, if you dont replace it for free, are the going to pay someone else to? Or just leave it as it is?

  • Glenn Sharp

    Member
    June 14, 2020 at 7:07 pm

    Just wanted to add this here incase it’s new to anyone…

    A few years ago I was adding some text out on site to a chemists fascia (powder coated aluminium) – I’d priced to give the whole sign a bit of a clean while I was up there but the 3M surface cleaner I was using wasnt having any effect

    Customer handed me a bottle of Vim cleaner – it was remarkable how easily the dirt and grime came off

  • David Rogers

    Member
    June 15, 2020 at 8:38 am
    quote Glenn Sharp:

    Just wanted to add this here incase it’s new to anyone…

    A few years ago I was adding some text out on site to a chemists fascia (powder coated aluminium) – I’d priced to give the whole sign a bit of a clean while I was up there but the 3M surface cleaner I was using wasnt having any effect

    Customer handed me a bottle of Vim cleaner – it was remarkable how easily the dirt and grime came off

    TFR is your friend…cleans a multitude of sins in the dirt, grime, grease & green gunge departments…have used Jif / Cif as a mild abrasive before….but once you start you have to do the whole lot!

    Regarding VIM…had one takeaway YEARS ago use that on a lighbox front that I stupidly thought "indoors, no UV, no dirt, changing it every 6 months…won’t need to laminate that". Staff member was told to clean it and rubbed most of the solvent ink off the vinyl with scouring powder…at what point after seeing the ink being scrubbed off did they go ‘sod it….he wants it clean, I’ll give him clean…"

  • Pane Talev

    Member
    June 15, 2020 at 5:30 pm

    Thank you for all the comment. I really appreciate it.

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