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  • Epson SureColor R5070 for vehicle wraps?

    Posted by Mariusz Czar on January 26, 2022 at 8:31 pm

    Looking to buy either latex hp 700 or epson R5070 so I dont have to deal with outgass and just want to finally switch to waterbased inks, just personal preference as i own vs540i for year and want upgrade it soon. Epson seems to have an edge by self replaceable but longer lasting print heads, but how resin based inks works with vehicle wraps, which I do frequently, but not just so want best aall rounder printer available.. In general heared lots of psoitives about Epson printers, ecosolvents ones, not much about resin, while with HP latex is hit and miss when it comes to reviews, generally older series 3 and 5xx. Curiois if anybody own this printer to tell color consistency / amount of heat needed when curing? Overall which one you would pick?

    Thanks!

    • This discussion was modified 3 months, 3 weeks ago by  Mariusz Czar.
    Robert Lambie replied 3 months ago 6 Members · 9 Replies
  • 9 Replies
  • Graham Scanlan

    Member
    January 27, 2022 at 6:33 am

    Hi Mariusz

    Of course this is my biased opinion, I’ve been around large format printers before solvent printers were invented. Both Roland and Mimaki have been the market leaders for many years. HP have been on a journey with their latex offering, getting a mostly water based ink to do the same or better job than eco solvent takes some doing. This is why there are mixed reviews mainly online. With every model the technology has got better, and heat required has got less. The 700 and 800 models are amazing machines, find your local distributor and book a demo and see for your self. I think I’m correct that these machines plug in the wall

    How HP deal with their white option is impressive, normally white ink is a pain to run unless you use it daily, with the 700W and 800W, you take out the white head and place it into a compartment in the machine where the printer takes care of it, it also flushes the pipes with distilled water.

    The latex inks come in around £100 a litre, so ink saving is a consideration, the ink also comes in boxes and pouches so no plastic waste

    The over coat option is another plus, this adds even more protection to the prints and on some jobs could save you laminating

    The 700W and 800w seem to print onto more eco friendly non pvc products so well aligned for the future of non pvc

    The Latex have always had the edge when it comes wrapping for reasons we all know about. One of the largest fleet livery companies only have latex machines and even print colour changes

    I won’t go into any more details, I think the ones above will get you started

    The above is a one sided opinion I know, but best to share the knowledge

  • Mariusz Czar

    Member
    February 4, 2022 at 4:38 pm

    Thanks. Unsure if I want deal with white inks, dont seem to have many jobs to utilize this feature greatly.. I always do revers lam white for stickers needed white layer, if got some inside of windows print request.. But 700 will be my contender, probably will wait till NEC Sign and digital expo to make decision and get some discounts maybe… I was more wondering about epson R5070 “rasin” printer opinions, especially when it comes to vehicle wrap printing..

    • Andy McGuinness

      Member
      February 10, 2022 at 1:26 pm

      The Epson R5000 (R5070) is pretty much Latex, they are both waterbased inks doing the same thing. Essentially if you can print onto it with Latex then you can with Resin. The ink technology is absolutely suitable for car wrapping. I was at Epson on Tuesday and saw L700 vs R5000 print samples and the R5000 was much more vibrant, had less graininess but still maintained the scratch resistance you’d expect with Latex. By all accounts, the media is much more stable with Epson and therefore panelling will line up nicely.

  • Graham Scanlan

    Member
    February 4, 2022 at 7:44 pm

    I’ll be at Sign Uk on the Pyramid Display stand, come over and have a chat and see if the numbers add up,

    Regards

    Graham

  • Jeff

    Member
    February 8, 2022 at 8:53 pm

    I have a HP360 and never had a problem at all with it.
    wraps, part wraps and vehicle graphics. 👍

  • Robert Lambie

    Administrator
    February 17, 2022 at 1:26 am

    Latex gets my vote!
    You will hear pros and cons on every machine. ease of use, easy maintenance, quality output etc. ticks all the boxes for me and I have had two for the past 7+ years and will buy another. I

    • Colin Crabb

      Member
      February 17, 2022 at 8:51 am

      +1 to Latex 360 and above!

      We no longer run solvent based machines, and just installed L700w to join its older brothers, top machines and less problems than solvents.

      • Mariusz Czar

        Member
        February 19, 2022 at 9:28 am

        Sure but I’m not consider solvent due to outgassing anymore… We do wraps, van graphics etc mainly, if need reprint something , its day delay.. Between Hp and Epson really…

  • Robert Lambie

    Administrator
    February 19, 2022 at 8:31 pm

    HP

    There is a misconception about HP latex printing, In as much as the lamination process.
    latex printer suppliers, sales reps, over-sell the machines based on the ink drying time. However, that is because HP themselves got this wrong. Keep in mind HP are specialists in making the machines, not how a huge list of media reacts to their machines printing on them or how they perform further along the line, once applied.

    Yes, you can laminate vinyl after it comes out of the machine but you should leave it as long as possible before doing so. Let’s just call this period the “settling period”.

    When you run vinyl through a latex printer the vinyl is being taken up to 110+ degrees. It is being jetted with ink chemicals, fans blowing on it. the vinyl is expanding and contracting, it’s being tugged on by the take-up system, tight wound again on the core, and more… it needs time to relax, settle and return to its cool temperature before moving to the next stage.

    You then laminate the latex prints, but again, you want to leave the laminated prints as long as possible. let’s just call this period the “bonding period”.

    Similar applies to the above. hot or cold laminated, it is pulled through and around rollers under tension. it is being bonded onto a new “ink-covered surface”.
    The laminate now requires time to “bond onto this ink”.
    e.g.
    take a bit of vinyl and stick it to a van.
    now pick it back off. it comes off easy!
    Try doing the same after a day sitting in the sun. it’s stuck solid!
    This is because the adhesive has been given time to reach its optimal bond and performs much better. So the same applies when you laminate onto an ink saturated surface! and by that I mean…
    The ink and vinyl must “settle” and once laminated, the laminate must be allowed to “bond”.

    this all doesn’t really come to light when the laminated prints are fitted to a flat sign surface. but it does when your next step is to apply the same two layers of vinyl and ink are quickly bridged across a deep recess of a vehicle and heat and over-stretched into the recess and stuck there, and “EXPECTED” to say there for good?

    Keep in mind, all vinyl types and brands react and perform differently. So It is NOT just about ink type and the manufacturing process.

    there is a list of boxes that must be ticked when manufacturing wraps and installing them and above are just a few things you must keep in mind.

    HP are aware of issues and have made modifications and improvements in the newest range of printers to help. Only time will tell…

    EPSON

    I have heard good reports about the recent Epson machines, but with new machines and more so, ink types. How well they will perform in the wrapping world is anyone guess. Epson, their distributors or sales reps will not be able to give you an educated guess any better than HP would have 10 years ago. Because they simply do not know until it is used in real-world environments.